GPS won't work at the base of the cliffs, I know cause I did a study for the preserve a few years ago with their equipment...
Maybe on the Carraige Road if it's at least a couple hunderd feet from the cliff.

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I was thinking those little solar powered sidewalk lights every 10 feet along the carriage path. They could all have numbers painted on them so you always know where you are, and they would help the climbers and hikers who get caught out after sunset.

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better yet, we could put interactive elements right into the cliff wall....press the button at the base and it tells you what route you're on. press another button after the first move and lester tells you what gear to place and how to set up for the next move....wow (can this go on my placard?).

AND we could put color tape on the all the moves. I mean since we all know getting off route is a serious problem that we have the power to fix and make it better right?

I've only been to the Gunks about 50 or so times. So there are still a number of areas that are still quite unfamiliar even at the cliff base - Ok, actually some that I have never even seen, forget familiarity. There are also a few places on the carriage road where I am quite sure where I am.

This addresses only the idea of marking the carriage road - not all of the sarcastic responses about marking the cliff, nor the good suggestions about asking cliff-side about routes from someone who is familiar.

The mileage marker idea might be useful to bikers and hikers. It would be useful to climbers as well, but only after they have marked up which ever version of the guide book they have, to correlate the distances with the climbs. Some of the guide book trail information is now inconsistent with the existing trail structure.

Marking the carriage road with the climb name or at least the area, however, does not depend over the long term on the locations of the trails. So, for example, the sign that says Arrow always tells you where you are on the carriage road relative to the climb. Likewise McCarthy wall could be correlated to any number of past or future guidebooks. The marking need not correspond with trail locations to be useful, only the cliff.

I have always thought that it would be nice to have some small permanent signage. If I want to just hike and enjoy nature, I can do it without spending hours to drive there. If I want to climb and enjoy the company of the people I am with, or happen to meet, having the signs would free me from keeping track of approximate hiking times or looking for landmarks that I might either not recognize or simply walk by. I have even missed the Minty Tree and I know what that looks like.

Obviously my regular partners are not some of the people who always know where they are. I have only been climbing a short time. I often bring people up who have climbed even less. But I also have often visited with people who nearly live there and even they sometime "get lost" on the carriage road.

Signage would be nice.

I've been there more times than I can count and still find myself sometimes lost in the summer. Of course, my memory issues may be why I'm unable to count very well. I would rather no signage.

Im sorry but If I'm not mistaken the carrage road is already marked just look at the stones that line the road way. Also If I'm not mistaken at least one guide book author already uses the stones in his guide books.....to correlate location vs route. So if that isn't good enough I don't think mile post marks will help, Also as a member of the Preserve I would be the first to bitch about signs marking climbs; and lets not forget about all of the others who are members that could care less about climbers........Use the resources at hand that we
already have; we are climbers playing in a Trad Area so act like one.

I like the dog idea, but couldn't the size of the animal indicate the difficulty? And the temperment the protection rating?

I like the idea of numbering (or color coding) the approach routes to the base of the cliff. That seems unobtrusive, helps people orient and get to the right area of the climb they are looking for, and might prevent people from making their own approach paths.

D4T

If one cannot find the route from the Gunks guidebook, they should not be climbing. What the heck are they going to do when it comes to route finding when halfway up the cliff?


Sign advocates are a bunch of Johnny-come-latelys that have no idea how to navigate or survive outside the urban jungle they live in.