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#19448 - 04/13/06 05:09 PM
Re: 5.8's in the Nears
[Re: Tom Breloff]
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member
Registered: 08/05/04
Posts: 136
Loc: New Brunswick, NJ
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The climbs you have listed are all pretty good.
For what its worth, Farewell to Arms was my first 8. It looks a little iffy from the ground but the gear is good and the climbing is pretty straight forward. I try to never TR, but you simply must TR To Be or Not to Be after doing this. It really great and right below the chains on Farewell.
Birdland is stellar, basically follows the pattern of: do a move, get a stance... Gear is great too. There is no reason to clip a pin on this climb.
This being said, your going to have to get really lucky to find these free this weekend. You would be better going down to Mainline.
Ive never been on Eastertime Too, so I cant say anything. Broken Sling might be a bit hard if youre just starting on 8s.
Hope that helps.
Ross
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#19450 - 04/13/06 06:01 PM
Re: 5.8's in the Nears
[Re: oenophore]
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addict
Registered: 12/23/99
Posts: 693
Loc: Delaware
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Alphonse, Eastertime Too and Main Line are all good, PG or G 5.8 climbs. If you lead Eastertime Too and don''t mind ruining the onsite, Good Friday Climb is worth a TR.
Birdland is one of the best, but a hard 5.8.
I would not recommend Broken Sling for an initial 5.8
Can't comment on Farewell to Arms, only followed it and that was years ago  .
TS
Edited by Timbo (04/13/06 06:02 PM)
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#19451 - 04/13/06 06:03 PM
Re: 5.8's in the Nears
[Re: oenophore]
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Pooh-Bah *
Registered: 09/07/01
Posts: 2483
Loc: Davis Sq., MA
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They're all very straighforward and well worth doing. Word of advice for Alphonse. Either do it in one pitch, or break into two: to the short tree ledge, then to the top. DO NOT belay below the crux, where one of the books suggests (Swain maybe?). I made this mistake once, and it was not fun.
Also worth doing is P1 of Fat Stick. From the top, traverse over to Generation Gap (I think) then work your way up and right to P3 of Yellow Ridge and finish on that. Nice "adventure" climb.
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we're all living proof that nothing lasts
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#19452 - 04/13/06 06:07 PM
Re: 5.8's in the Nears
[Re: nerdom]
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Pooh-Bah *
Registered: 09/07/01
Posts: 2483
Loc: Davis Sq., MA
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As for Broken Sling, if you're okay with bouldering, you should be fine. It's a bouldery start, you get good pro from a pretty good stance (look left of the nose for the pro), and just go. Nothing hard or dangerous after that. Abundant, solid pro. I'm speaking of P1 only. I'd personally avoid P2 if you're just breaking into the grade.
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we're all living proof that nothing lasts
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#19453 - 04/13/06 06:59 PM
Re: 5.8's in the Nears
[Re: Tom Breloff]
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Pooh-Bah
Registered: 01/16/00
Posts: 1983
Loc: SoCal
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As a perennial 5.8 leader, here are my thoughts and probably too much beta:
-- Alphonse is great. There are really only two 5.8 spots - the P2 corner can be a bit 5.8, and pulling the overlap on P3. Thing is, the hanging belay above P2 is really awful and to be avoided. Best thing would be to combine at least P2 and P3, but you'll need doubles or some really good eye for rope drag - it wanders about as much as Disneyland. You might want to suffer the hanging belay just to get the lay of the land down, then combine pitches your next time on it.
-- Broken Sling is stout for 5.8 and has a well-earned reputation for injury. You can clearly see why. It doesn't let up that much after the beginning, either.
-- Birdland has my number. The first crux - for short-reachy whiners like me only - is down by the first pin, and it's HARD for me. The real crux is easier, but more mental. The gear is tricky, and I've caught a damn big fall from the crux where the gear blew - the guy ended up swinging below the overhanging nose. I'm not a big fan of the route.
-- Eastertime 2 is great. Solid 5.8, but solidly G. Good Friday is 5.9, but PG-13 at the least ... so I would "save" other 5.9s for onsighting, go ahead and TR it.
-- Mainline: P1 is fantastic, 5.8 lite and fairly well protected IMO. P2 has an awkward/pumpy pull over a bulge where you have a choice of a) gear or b) a hold; and the fall is a smack onto a slab. Leader must not fall.
-- Outsider - just past Mainline - fantastic. Plus it gets a rope over the Voids, one of which looks 5.8 and isn't!
-- Moxie/Giddah (can't remember which is which) - warm up on the very nice 5.6, then do the 5.8. It's tricky. And short, but good.
-- Yellow Belly. Do the "direct start" (5.9) - much more aesthetic, and you won't fall anywhere, cam right at your waist.
Yo nerdom - how's the gear on P1 of Fat Stick?
Edited by Julie (04/13/06 07:08 PM)
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#19455 - 04/13/06 07:18 PM
Re: 5.8's in the Nears
[Re: crackers]
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Pooh-Bah
Registered: 08/05/02
Posts: 2244
Loc: a heavily fortified bunker!
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Farewell to Arms, in the words of Lord Helmet (and everyone here loves his opinions but on this I happen to agree with him)
is not 5.8PG, it's 5.7+ R.
Took me a lot of time spent on gear dickery to lead it. Much better to get M.S. to free solo it for you if you want to hang a rope off those anchors
Edited by pedestrian (04/13/06 07:19 PM)
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#19456 - 04/13/06 07:32 PM
Re: 5.8's in the Nears
[Re: pedestrian]
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gumby
Registered: 03/12/02
Posts: 2308
Loc: Hudson Valley, NY
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I'll agree w/ Ped and say that while Farewell To Arms is a good route (and the best TR bonus on the planet as your reward  ), it's not for the budding 5.8 leader. (sorry dude, it's not R rated tho - at least, no moreso than Hyjecks is  ) Even getting up the opening corner and getting started on the traverse is sketchy, if not actually hard climbing. Very insecure feeling. Then you clip the pins, and if you don't know to extend a really long runner, you'll hose yourself w/ rope drag as you move up the steepening corner. (he says, from experience) Which is where the route gets its name, cuz you get more and more pumped moving up, and you get to a point where you can try to hang in for one more piece, or say F it and grab the horn and go around the corner. I always do the latter, but if one were to come off having done so it would be ugly.  Eastertime Too is only 5.8 if you have good jamming skills. I didn't then (not that I do now), so it was a hangfest for me. If you can get somebody to gun the 5.9 p2 of Grand Central for ya, the 5.8 last pitch is fun, albeit short. Agreed that Alphonse should be done in 2 pitches, sans the bogus hanging belay. Much nicer that way.
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"Flailing?" "Flail on!"
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#19457 - 04/13/06 07:36 PM
Re: 5.8's in the Nears
[Re: MurphysLaw]
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Pooh-Bah
Registered: 08/05/02
Posts: 2244
Loc: a heavily fortified bunker!
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Murph it shoud be noted that pedestrians NEVER EVER exaggerate.
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#19460 - 04/14/06 12:13 AM
Re: 5.8's in the Nears
[Re: Tom Breloff]
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member
Registered: 06/27/03
Posts: 189
Loc: New England
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Modern times is a great 5.8 to give a go.
Hey, It's not crimpy.
But seriously, I liked Boldville a lot. It's on the Winter/Spring wall. Great gear and short. Then you can TR a bunch of sick stuff.
Birdland pitch 2 is really pumpy for an 8. Save it for later. But do it. P1 is an easy lead.
Just did P2 of Diana which was very nice...
Alpine Diversions is also a good one. A bit pumpy but good smaller gear and a fixed nut below the crux roof. Nothing but air to hit.
-Fear
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#19461 - 04/14/06 03:22 AM
Re: 5.8's in the Nears
[Re: Tom Breloff]
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veteran
Registered: 12/23/99
Posts: 1299
Loc: New York, N.Y.
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Alphonse is pretty soft for an 8. I'm not sure where the first spot Julie is talking about is, I think there's only heading into the notch after the overhang. And the hanging belay isn't a hanging belay if you set up in just the right spot (which is all the way to the left). By the way, wthout doubles, it can't really be done in one pitch without unpleasant rope drag - I say this from unpleasant experience.
The gear on Birdland is impeccable. There's no reason not to make this an early lead in one's 5.8 career. Ditto for Eastertime Too, except that the gear is definitely hard to get in. Some people skip it, and that's a big mistake. But if you hang in there and get it (or even if you fall trying) it's quite safe.
I don't know if Farewell To Arms is R or not, but I can say that there are some 5.8 moves where you really don't want to fall. Baskerville (which is rated 5.7+) as well gets PG13 in the Swain book, and I agree with that. You'd bang yourself up pretty good if you fell at the end of the crux sequence. Very puzzling crux, by the way, hence very satisfying when you finally pull it.
Main Line is a great climb, but there are some issues with the gear that make it less than ideal for an early 5.8 leader.
We haven't mentioned Outer Space, by the way. There's a couple of PG spots, but the climbing there is way below 5.8. A good early lead.
5.8 is a great grade at the Gunks, but not as much in the Nears as in the Trapps, where there are tons of great pitches, many of them fine for someone breaking into the grade.
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#19462 - 04/14/06 05:24 AM
Re: 5.8's in the Nears
[Re: Steven Cherry]
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Carpal Tunnel
Registered: 07/10/00
Posts: 3532
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Quote:
We haven't mentioned Outer Space, by the way. There's a couple of PG spots, but the climbing there is way below 5.8. A good early lead.
Except for the single crux move...harder for short wing-span folks...and if your second blows it and doesn't know how to prusik, you're in for a bit of an epic. (The second gets to remove the gear before doing the crux. The next gear is well off to the left and will leave the second hanging below a very large O/H and well out from the rock if they fall. If they're lowered to the ground and try to reclimb, they're facing ground fall from 5.7 moves 35' up before getting back to the crux.)
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- Marc
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#19465 - 04/14/06 10:19 PM
Re: 5.8's in the Nears
[Re: Julie]
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Pooh-Bah
Registered: 08/05/02
Posts: 2244
Loc: a heavily fortified bunker!
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or a little bitty nut placed in the bottom of that funky pod
or a #6 BD stopper placed SIDEWAYS to utilize the taper.
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#19470 - 04/15/06 06:42 PM
Re: 5.8's in the Nears
[Re: Steven Cherry]
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Carpal Tunnel
Registered: 07/10/00
Posts: 3532
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Quote:
What's the crux move on Outer Space that would leave you hanging? I've always thought the hardest climbing was in the final corner.
The balancy steps to the left from the little arete below the first o/hang. It involves a long reach left, esp. if you're short, then a few steps leftward (a little reminiscent of Jim's Gem but going in the other direction) till you can step up and reach the holds below the big, long roof, where you traverse left again to the hanging corner, up that, then hand traverse left once more to the little belay out on the point.
The leader's protection is at the arete (used to be a fixed lost arrow). The next piece is about 10' - 12' left and above the o/h. All this is going on just above a very large roof - if the second blows that initial step left (crux) s/he gets to do a big swing below that roof.
[Disclaimer: it's been a number of years since I've done this route, so protection now may be different, esp. with micro cams, et al. However, that doesn't alter my perception of which move is the crux. While the upper corner and traverse is scrunchy and a bit awkward, it always seemed about 5.7 (and this coming from a 6' person who feels Le Plie is about 10b!  ]
_________________________
- Marc
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#19471 - 04/15/06 07:44 PM
Re: 5.8's in the Nears
[Re: MarcC]
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addict
Registered: 07/13/00
Posts: 529
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The last time I did this route - albeit some years ago - the protection for the move Mark mentions was a knifeblade. If that pulls, you might hit the ground, and I don't think there are other protection possibilities in the area. Once you do this move and enter the corner, it might be possble (with double ropes) to move back right under the roof, place a piece, and by doing so, protect the second for that part of the route.
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#19474 - 04/16/06 04:52 AM
Re: 5.8's in the Nears
[Re: Tom Breloff]
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journeyman
Registered: 07/12/04
Posts: 56
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Broken Sling has the scary boulder move off the ground that everyone mentioned. I don't remember anything hard about the rest of the climb.
Birdland is one of my all time favorite climbs on the planet. Much like Son of Easy O. Don't miss the second pitch. Probably stiff for someone just breaking into 5.8s.
I thought Eastertime Too was a cakewalk. But I'm 6'1" and the opening moves were easy for me. I saw a strong climber get shut down on that section.
Farewell to Arms was scary, and I've only climbed it on toprope :-) I need to lead that one of these days and see if it feels as hard.
Yellow Belly (and Yellow Ridge at 5.7) are two that I'd add to the list.
If 5.8 starts feeling easy, check out Roseland. It is a soft 5.9 with a well protected crux.
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#19478 - 04/17/06 01:24 PM
Re: 5.8's in the Nears
[Re: Steven Cherry]
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Pooh-Bah *
Registered: 09/07/01
Posts: 2483
Loc: Davis Sq., MA
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congrats! But you might want to get Mainline and Son of Easy O under your belt before jumping on Modern Times! ah, what the hell do I know? If you've got the sac, just friggin' go for it, bro!
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we're all living proof that nothing lasts
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#19479 - 04/17/06 07:10 PM
Re: 5.8's in the Nears
[Re: fear]
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newbie
Registered: 08/20/05
Posts: 36
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Quote:
Alpine Diversions is also a good one. A bit pumpy but good smaller gear and a fixed nut below the crux roof. Nothing but air to hit.
-Fear
You can thank me for that fixed nut. I did it about 3 weeks ago. If anyone extracts it and wants to return it, I'll offer a nice reward.
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#19480 - 04/17/06 07:16 PM
Re: 5.8's in the Nears
[Re: Steven Cherry]
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newbie
Registered: 03/28/06
Posts: 27
Loc: NYC
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Quote:
I don't see the advantage of linking pitches 2 and 3
In my case, I placed so much gear on the 1st pitch that I was out of slings (and most of my cams) by the time I made it to the crux. I might have skipped the hanging belay all together if I had enough gear to finish the climb. I suppose the hanging belay wouldn't have been so bad if I actually hung, instead of trying to sit on the ledge.
By the way...I don't quite have the sac for Modern Times yet...I think that will be one of the last 5.8's to attempt, especially since I suck at roofs.
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#19481 - 04/17/06 08:18 PM
Re: 5.8's in the Nears
[Re: Tom Breloff]
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Pooh-Bah
Registered: 08/05/02
Posts: 2244
Loc: a heavily fortified bunker!
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If we're talking about which 5.8's are hardest, IMO Bonnie's is a lot harder than Modern Times, at least if you do MT properly, which means staying on a sequence of holds dictated by where the route goes, not by where you want the gear to be, and moving quickly.
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#19482 - 04/18/06 01:14 AM
Re: 5.8's in the Nears
[Re: pedestrian]
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member
Registered: 06/27/03
Posts: 189
Loc: New England
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'Cause Bonnie's is a solid 5.9.
-Fear
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#19483 - 04/18/06 01:43 AM
Re: 5.8's in the Nears
[Re: fear]
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Pooh-Bah
Registered: 08/05/02
Posts: 2244
Loc: a heavily fortified bunker!
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#19484 - 04/18/06 12:44 PM
Re: 5.8's in the Nears
[Re: pedestrian]
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Pooh-Bah *
Registered: 09/07/01
Posts: 2483
Loc: Davis Sq., MA
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Just MHO, but I think MT is harder than Bonnie's. I led Bonnie's long before I jumped on MT. In fact, I'd say that MT is harder than Bonnie's Direct even. For me, anyway.
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we're all living proof that nothing lasts
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#19485 - 04/18/06 02:39 PM
Re: 5.8's in the Nears
[Re: nerdom]
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newbie
Registered: 05/24/05
Posts: 25
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Modern Times is pumpy but well protected. Great route, Favorite 5.7+ at the Gunks.. Not one nmove on it harder than 5.7+...just a string of pumpy moves,. All jugs.. Ape Call is harder and so is Casablanca. Birdland is well protected at the crux. Just slam in a yellow alien or TCU. Bomber. Best 5.8 face climb in the Nears. Exquisite movement.
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#19486 - 04/18/06 05:16 PM
Re: 5.8's in the Nears
[Re: B_9]
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enthusiast
Registered: 08/19/04
Posts: 210
Loc: north by northeast (from jerse...
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Quote:
Modern Times is pumpy but well protected. Great route, Favorite 5.7+ at the Gunks.. Not one nmove on it harder than 5.7+...just a string of pumpy moves,. All jugs.. Ape Call is harder and so is Casablanca. Birdland is well protected at the crux. Just slam in a yellow alien or TCU. Bomber. Best 5.8 face climb in the Nears. Exquisite movement.
Ape Call is not harder Then the second pitch of MT. (maybe the first pitch...)
your just being a sillyhead
but, it is a spectacular climb in its own right, get past the start and the top will have you all gitty.
Not recommended for new 8 leaders.
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#19487 - 04/28/06 03:42 PM
Re: 5.8's in the Nears
[Re: caver]
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veteran
Registered: 03/22/00
Posts: 1515
Loc: CT
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I backed off Outer Space the first time I tried to lead it because of how hard it was to get the pin clipped and how scary it was to start that traverse seeing no more gear ahead of you. The trick, to both, is to ignore all the chalked jugs on the right and approach the pin from the left. Not only is the pin waaaaay easier to clip for us short folks from the left, but there aren't any hard moves left after you clip it. You do have to go a ways before the next gear but it's all pretty solid from there and if you step up to the horizontal and place as far right as you can it's not that bad for the second (who should clean the pin from the left as well).
I seem to recall that a tricam works at the crux of Birdland too. I usually get two pieces in there, I think. Also, if you find the secret hold at the "crux" then the crux really is down there at the first pin, especially for shorter folks.
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#19488 - 05/04/06 04:19 PM
Re: 5.8's in the Nears
[Re: Tom Breloff]
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stranger
Registered: 04/30/06
Posts: 17
Loc: Cherry Hill NJ
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Tom I climbed Alphonse on the same weekend and i think we went after you.
I did it in a single pitch, it was great , but next time i will carry more double runners to lessen the drag
Michael H
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#19489 - 05/08/06 12:39 PM
Re: 5.8's in the Nears
[Re: dalguard]
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stranger
Registered: 04/30/06
Posts: 17
Loc: Cherry Hill NJ
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while waiting for farewell to arms i witnessed leader fall at the start of birdland, he had a deck touch down, due to the fact that belayer stumbled and lost footing...
Message need a belayer with a keen eye to your move on that opening sequence
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#19490 - 06/12/06 07:20 PM
Re: 5.8's in the Nears
[Re: Tom Breloff]
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newbie
Registered: 03/28/06
Posts: 27
Loc: NYC
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Now that I've been on a few 5.8's, I figured I'd share my experience:
Alphonse - The crux is not that hard, but it's somewhat commiting. The rest of the climb is pretty straightforward. Skip the hanging belay.
Eastertime Too (P1) - Good gear, and the climbing isn't that bad. I felt pretty safe, although still pumped.
Birdland - Awesome face climb. I cruised both cruxes on the first pitch only to take a fall making the short traverse around the arete...boy did I feel stupid. I came back another day to onsight the second pitch.
Drunkards Delight - Twice I did this route, and both times I was more scared on the roof than the crux. The crux is balancy, but I can take my time figuring out the exact sequence, whereas the roof forces you to "just do it".
Arrow - This is a safe/easy 5.8 IMO. The roof has good gear and isn't too hard, and the final crux has a "hidden" crimper that I can reach.
Moxie - This started so well, until I stood up in the corner and realized I had no gear and no handholds. I spent 10 minutes with just my right thumb keeping me on the rock until I figured out the sequence to get out. I think it will be much easier on the repeat attempt.
Annie Oh! - Except for the 5.7R first pitch, this climb was awesome. I think I had a shaky brown tricam and a black alien as my only gear 40 feet up the climb, and the situation didn't improve for another 15 feet. Do people normally climb this, or do you climb P1 of Three Doves instead?
Son of Easy O (P1) - Sweet! This is the best face climb I've ever been on! I took a couple short falls on the opening move, protected by an equalized black alien and small nut. I came back another day to climb it clean. Both times I didn't have the strength (balls) to climb the second pitch, but I'll be coming back to it soon.
Morning After (P1) - The crux was somewhat awkward and reachy, but not too difficult. We rapped off the first belay because the 2nd pitch overhang was swarming with wasps. It looked nice, though.
Hyjek's Horror (TR) - I toproped this yesterday, and lets just say that I'm very glad I didn't lead it. Oh, the horror!
High on my tick list: Mainline, Pas De Deux, Airy Area, Farewell to Arms, Son of Easy O (P2), Three Doves, Broken Sling, Double Crack, and Modern Times (roughly in that order)
Thanks again for all the advice.
Tom
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#19492 - 06/12/06 11:32 PM
Re: 5.8's in the Nears
[Re: Ethan]
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Carpal Tunnel
Registered: 09/24/01
Posts: 5571
Loc: 212 land
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(Here comes the killjoy  ) What is the title of this thread now?
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#19493 - 06/13/06 02:14 AM
Re: 5.8's in the Nears
[Re: Tom Breloff]
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veteran
Registered: 03/22/00
Posts: 1515
Loc: CT
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People lead P1 of Annie Oh because it has a REPUTATION. It's the sort of thing that once you've done it you don't necessarily have to do it again, although once you've done it you kind of know the trick. The trick is that you get no gear for 40 feet and it mellows after that.
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#19494 - 06/13/06 10:58 AM
Re: 5.8's in the Nears
[Re: Tom Breloff]
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journeyman
Registered: 05/06/05
Posts: 84
Loc: Central Nj
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Quote:
High on my tick list: Mainline, Pas De Deux, Airy Area, Farewell to Arms, Son of Easy O (P2), Three Doves, Broken Sling, Double Crack, and Modern Times (roughly in that order)
The second pitch of Son of Easy O is alot easier than the first, its just more mentally challanging. I think it is actually easier than the top pitch of high E - the holds are enormous and you have a corner to stem in. The trick is just to not get pumped.
Also, I wouldnt recomend trying modern times until your really comfortable on things like P2 of son of easy o. I followed modern times a while ago and I barely flopped onto the top ledge, the exposure was much greater than the son of roof and its about twice as steep. I still think it would easily be a 10 at a different area, or at least a hard 9.
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- Grey
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#19495 - 06/13/06 01:29 PM
Re: 5.8's in the Nears
[Re: greyalien]
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veteran
Registered: 03/22/00
Posts: 1515
Loc: CT
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I'd agree about P2 of Son of Easy O. It's not tricky. Three Doves is a 9 in some books and is at least PG and maybe worse at the start of the second pitch. I'd leave that one for moving into 9s. The trick to MT is that it's got a trick. If done right, it's easily 5.8 but you'll never do it right on the first try. Make sure your second can follow it or at least knows how to prusik. Many a second has had an epic old time under the MT roof.
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#19496 - 06/13/06 03:32 PM
Re: 5.8's in the Nears
[Re: greyalien]
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addict
Registered: 05/02/04
Posts: 672
Loc: Chattanooga, TN
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Quote:
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High on my tick list: Mainline, Pas De Deux, Airy Area, Farewell to Arms, Son of Easy O (P2), Three Doves, Broken Sling, Double Crack, and Modern Times (roughly in that order)
The second pitch of Son of Easy O is alot easier than the first, its just more mentally challanging. I think it is actually easier than the top pitch of high E - the holds are enormous and you have a corner to stem in. The trick is just to not get pumped.
The 2nd P is the same grade as the first and is in no way, shape, or form, easier than High Exposure. Pitch 1 is technical. The non-technical, and mostly straight forward nature of Pitch 2 does not lower its grade, which is 5.8 as well.
So while you may THINK it is easier, it is in fact, not. This reality suggests that your thoughts could actually be wrong; a condition I noticed from many of your posts indicating you may not have the correct thought process working for you.
Grading of rock climbs is not as subjective as many people think. There is actuallly an underlying science behind it that most people tend to ignore since it often does not fit well with their personal paradigms, needs, desires, or wishes.
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#19497 - 06/14/06 04:42 AM
Re: 5.8's in the Nears
[Re: dalguard]
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member
Registered: 06/27/03
Posts: 189
Loc: New England
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... The trick to MT is that it's got a trick. If done right, it's easily 5.8 but you'll never do it right on the first try....
All right... cough up the trick.
-Fear
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#19498 - 06/14/06 01:51 PM
Re: 5.8's in the Nears
[Re: fear]
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Pooh-Bah *
Registered: 09/07/01
Posts: 2483
Loc: Davis Sq., MA
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Forget tricks - go to Janette's website (cliffmama.com) and check out the pics of Johnny-somebody-or-other climbing MT. It freakin' diagrams the roof sequence move-by-move!
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we're all living proof that nothing lasts
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#19499 - 06/14/06 02:09 PM
Re: 5.8's in the Nears
[Re: nerdom]
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Carpal Tunnel
Registered: 07/05/00
Posts: 3396
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#19500 - 06/14/06 02:58 PM
Re: 5.8's in the Nears
[Re: fear]
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veteran
Registered: 03/22/00
Posts: 1515
Loc: CT
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FYI, I pm'd Fear as I know some people don't like beta.
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#19501 - 06/14/06 03:08 PM
Re: 5.8's in the Nears
[Re: dalguard]
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Pooh-Bah
Registered: 10/06/01
Posts: 2491
Loc: Sittin' Pretty in Fat City
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since the topic is about the nears, thought to relate that Broken Sling kicked my ass on Sunday. I thought I was pretty competant on 8s before this. The initial climbing before and including placing my first pro left me done and required 3 long hangs to finish the climb. Thankfully, BD2 didn't get a hand cramp from all the time he had me locked off.
Might have been different for me on TR, as Eastertime, Far from the Maddening Crowd, and even Good Friday felt way easier later that day when following. Of course, these climbs were also more of a face climb.
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#19502 - 06/14/06 03:18 PM
Re: 5.8's in the Nears
[Re: fear]
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Pooh-Bah
Registered: 08/05/02
Posts: 2244
Loc: a heavily fortified bunker!
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Quote:
Quote:
... The trick to MT is that it's got a trick. If done right, it's easily 5.8 but you'll never do it right on the first try....
All right... cough up the trick.
-Fear
just don't waste energy slinging the tree. stay on the route, which moves to the right
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#19503 - 06/14/06 06:21 PM
Re: 5.8's in the Nears
[Re: drkodos]
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old hand
Registered: 04/24/01
Posts: 758
Loc: livin' on the edge
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Quote:
Grading of rock climbs is not as subjective as many people think. There is actuallly an underlying science behind it that most people tend to ignore since it often does not fit well with their personal paradigms, needs, desires, or wishes.
Well, good doctor, would you be so kind as to enlighten the poster who inspired your quoted reply, myself, and the rest of the GDC community, and reveal the underlying science of rock climb grading, especially vis-a-vis the climbs at issue.
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(not that there's anything wrong with that...sorta)
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#19504 - 06/14/06 07:33 PM
Re: 5.8's in the Nears
[Re: browndog2]
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addict
Registered: 01/05/00
Posts: 513
Loc: Watertown, NY
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I had a similar 'grade the climb, not the climber' conversation earlier this week. Is the process scientific? Drkodos can tackle that. But it is iterative, as with a theory subject to modification upon further testing. And going back to the point that started all this, I'd agree that it's not that useful to compare the difficulty of Son of Easy O's P2 with High E, other than to say that both pitches involve large handholds.
Since the OP was talking about 8s in the Nears, I'll shift back on topic. Both Broken Sling and Farewell to Arms were mentioned, as was Alphonse. All 8s, but hardly equal. Alphonse has one 5.8 move on it, whereas the other two are considerably more burly and continuous at the grade. Yet in my opinion, they're the climbs to go for. Farewell is a climb that anyone who gets a charge out of the crimpy puzzles that Annie Oh! presents will probably enjoy. As a kid I liked to play on a jungle gym, and I'm reminded of the fun that was on both of these climbs.
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#19505 - 06/14/06 11:18 PM
Re: 5.8's in the Nears
[Re: Frank Florence]
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Carpal Tunnel
Registered: 05/01/01
Posts: 3120
Loc: in your backyard
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Grades Scientific? What? If we were all built exactly the same as human beings that conversation *might* not be waste of bandwidth.
Screw the grades, if you climb by the grades you will only be fighting your own mind of how things 'should' be, and try to either rationalize a climb to fit the grade or curse it to no end as a sandbag.
I don't mean take off on 11 r's when youre looking for 8's but enjoy the routes for what they are, infinite variations of movement over rock. Sometimes you dont get to complete all the moves but thats what they make tomorrow for.
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#19507 - 06/16/06 02:17 AM
Re: 5.8's in the Nears
[Re: greyalien]
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journeyman
Registered: 05/27/05
Posts: 99
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Are you totally clueless as to how a route gets its grade?
No, but obviously you are. A first ascent party with skills and a sense of adventure comes along and climbs a line that strikes them as interesting. They stick a number on it. They tell their friends, who also have skills, about it. They hem and haw with the FA team and finally come to agreement about the number. The route gets a reputation. It goes in a guide book. Years later herds of gumby hacks fall their way to the top. They all gather around singing kum-by-ya and whine about the difficulty of the route and decide to call it a bigger number to stroke their delicate egos. Years later a new guide book comes out with the new grade. Voila ! Everything becomes 2 grades harder.
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#19509 - 06/19/06 01:36 PM
Re: 5.8's in the Nears
[Re: Tom Breloff]
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newbie
Registered: 03/28/06
Posts: 27
Loc: NYC
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Quote:
Now that I've been on a few 5.8's, I figured I'd share my experience:
I have a few more to add!
Son of Easy O (P2) - Awesome! Combined with the sweet face climbing below, this is now my favorite climb in the gunks.
Three Doves (P2) - I thought the final moves through the flake would be the crux, but it was actually the blank face below the roof. I screwed up my feet, and ended up deadpointing to a hold during that sequence. Fun fun!
Casablanca - This gets the award for the most wild roof I've ever been on. I can't claim the onsight because I rested on my gear before I pulled the roof, but I still climbed it without falling.
What a great day of climbing!
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