I nominate the first 40 feet of Midnight Cowboy.

In my limited experience, I would say the last forty feet of Hi Coroner.

This third and final pitch starts with unprotected easy-ish moves up to some fun, gently overhanging stemming moves (get in a bad cam, then a good cam). In the end I had to really commit to these moves and climb through without placing any additonal pro. Topped-out on slightly slopey, muddy ground while fighting a pump and trying not to think about a potential 25 foot fall. Kinda spicy, very exciting and fun.

I could say Honky Tonk woman but it's not really that exciting, only dangerous. What's that one that goes up a bit, then does a traverse where both the leader and second are in groundfall range, then has pumpy (more traversing) moves until a final hee-ya up and around a corner/roof? Browndog should know.

Hmm...two definitions of excitement. Excitement because the ground is perhaps too far away and excitement because the ground is perhaps too close.

Dawn, I believe you're talking about Commando Rave.

Yeah, that's it. That's 40 interesting feet.

How about the beginning of Maria Direct? I recall after the first good piece was in not far from the ground, it was pretty sustained & scarey until I could get a decent stance to put in my 2nd piece. My belayer was telling me to put something in soon because I was high enough above my last piece that it was groundfall, but I didn't have a stance and couldn't stop.

not that ive ever led it, but I'll agree with that.
especially with the "dude, you should get a piece in" part.

I'll second that. That lead for me was one of the first times I had to rely solely on my ability-not-to-fall to protect myself. Your pro is not going to do save you, your belayer is not going to help in any way, down-climbing probably would be more dangerous than continuing up.

I had to just know that I was going to make the moves, there was no other option. Once I mentally committed to climb through the scary section, it was not hard. It was a pretty intense moment though.

I've got to disagree, having protected that route and having caught that fall. You can fall doing the stand up move and the pin/piece you placed to back up the pin will catch you - barely, with an alert belayer, and with your toes perhaps touching down. Once you stand up you have to place again. This can be done and done well.

Anyway, Maria Direct is only about 20 feet of climbing, so I don't think it can qualify.

That route is "G" after the initial move to the pin if your belayer is paying attention and you’re also quick with gear at the top of the right facing corner……its one of those “Pro and Go” type routes…

Most fun you can have on 5.9 in the Gunks in less then 20’ from the deck IMHO

Agreeing with Dawn here - I've caught the fall of someone whose feet were at the level of the pin in on Maria Direct (sun was in his eyes, he just coudn't get settled into the stance there). His feet did not touch the ground, but not by much. However, this was with a very close, attentive belay.

oh jesus now you want me to pay attention??

Scared-y-cat that I am, I've lead that with 2 more pieces before the decent stance placement. Yes, I did; and my forearms had U.S.Lumber stamped on them for the rest of the day. Fear is a great motivator, and I sure didn't want to re-boulder the start.

Before tiny cams and when the pin kept getting pulled, Hyjeks was a pretty fun first 20 feet.

The first pitch of Beyond Good and Evil goes at 9ish I think (but I don't have a guidebook with me) and a very exciting first forty, maybe fifty, it is.

As with Midnight Cowboy I'll refrain from detailing why to avoid spoiling anyone's "fun".

yea i persoally think after that first hard move on maria direct it s fairly straightfoward to get to an established rest. Fun yes. 'excitingly scary' not really

Maybe I have a different notion of "exiting." I don't think it necessarily means risky, dangerous, or with potential groundfall (I'd just call that scary). So with that proviso in mind ...

I really love p2 of Keep On Struttin'. A good roof to a rest at a bolt, then a tricky move up to a horizontal and go-go-go traverse and pull through the notch--it really doesn't let up. Good moves, good exposure, good sustained climbing, packs a lot into a pitch that's only 50 feet but sure feels a lot longer!

I've heard Traverse of the Clods has a high pucker factor, and it's a 9 in the new book. Thoughts?

I thought it was always a nine.

5.8 in Swain, 5.8 in the Williams Select, 5.9 in the gray Dick.

So I quess my idea of exciting, when I was climbing a lot, was unexpectedly near my limit and unexpectedly unprotected.

Well, smikey would know, having taken that fall and i'm not even that great a belayer...

hmm, it looks like I'm greatly outnumbered regarding Maria Direct, though I don't really recall that little corner above the pin being good for anything except pretend gear. And I certainly am not hearing any stories about falling onto a jingus HB in that little crack.

Perhaps all you people telling me how great that pin is actually gave up and fell onto the pin before you actually committed to climbing into groundfall territory.

For those of you placing gear in that little crack, what did you use? Did you not feel like you were just wasting energy and making it more dangerous for yourself?

There is a great side pull jug in the crack when you fully stand up in the corner............gear?!

Maria Direct takes a good small nut (#1 or #2 Wallnut, I think I used) once you pull the move above the pin (backed up with a cam, of course!) and get the decent rest stance. And yeah, I've seen people come off there and not deck.

i believe ive seen a red alien placed in a HURRY after getting the stance after the pin.
in a HURRY.

Yeah I've tried to get a nut in there and it can be fiddly but a red-yellow Alien (IIRC) slides in like butter.

BrownPants, we don't mean to make you angry. Sounds like you onsighted the thing which is a helluva an onsight. Some of us have been on it one bazillion times. So first off, back up the pin, eh? Secondly, you're exactly in ground fall range when your feet are standing on (next to) the pin. That's where you put gear in again (see above). If you blow the move trying to stand up, you come very, very close to hitting the ground and easily could hit the ground if your belayer were belaying you the way I've seen some belayers belay. So it's not a move to make lightly. It's committing and if you haven't been on the route before, you don't know you can gear once you stand up, and it's not a great stance to fiddle a nut in from. I've personally downclimbed from that spot when I couldn't get something in fast enough. So it's by no means a gimme, but yeah, it can be done safely.

He weighs thirteen pounds. You don't even need a belay device for him....

You are correct on both assumptions.

Well I have come up to a belay of yours from time to time, only to see you throw your hands up in the air and go "check it out hip belay!"

Whoops! I guess I got a little argumentative there..

Interesting gear beta, thanks. When I got up in that little corner, it just seemed so improbable that I would have the gas to hang out and figure out the gear. So I had to decide to either downclimb/hang-on-the-pin or just go for it and trust myself. That was why I thought it was exciting.

So maybe the route isn't exciting in and of itself, maybe it was just my approach to it.

Bonnie's Roof... I sure find it exciting... is it 5.9?

maria direct is a boulder problem with good gear

I am confused...How did this post go from comparing a route that is 9+/10- (depending on the guide book) and involves soloing the first 30-40 feet to a single move 5.9 G route.

Kent you couldn't have been more puckered than on P1 of E.M.

Well, it was excitingly scary for me, especially since I probably didn't have any right to be leading that climb. I think that was my first 5.9 lead at the Gunks. Was just one of those days when the Frogs Head start to Maria was already occupied, and I was feeling very confident and decided to go for it instead of waiting. I made it, but it definitely put me back in my place.

Jannette

We'll break it down by feet of 5.9:

Most exciting 40 feet: Midnight Cowboy
20 feet: Maria Direct
10 feet: The Dangler
5 feet: Jean

I'm a little hesitant to participate here, since the fact that I did the first ascent of Midnight Cowboy (39 years ago) might count as prejudice. If I may say so, it is an excellent route and the bottom 30 feet is by no means the only exciting part.

I seem to remember a fairly good dose of adreneline on Heather. Gray Dick has it as Hether, puts it at R-X, and doesn't list it in boldface, a double kiss of death. I recall placing protection off to the side in the Pas De Deux crack, and I think that eliminates the X part of the rating, but there's no gettin' around the R part.

Two other exciting 5.9 leads are Lito and the Swan and Wild Horses.

How about Land's End? I remember that being slightly nervewracking

How bout a complete exercise in futility: Something Boring.

High Times

Deep Lichen

and the "5.8" climbing above the cruxes of Muriel's Nose and Tough Shift.

Fantasia at the leap

One of the pitches on Crack of Fear is 5.9...they were all equally exciting.

Solitary confinement in Tuolumne

The Hollow Flake on the Salathe...maybe more like 140 feet.

Yum Yum Yab Yum only has one scary move rated 5.9 so I guess its more like 5.3 in the gunks.

Yeah, neither Pedestrian nor I could find the "-" or the "G" on this "5.9- G" climb. John Peterson's Gunks site says "Better pro than it looks from the ground but still scary to lead. There's no real crux - just 40 or 50 feet of steep, continuous climbing with few good rests."

But even with my limited experience at the grade, I'd put others ahead of it in terms of excitement. What about Grim Ace Face? Is the crux too short to qualify? (I haven't done it.)

Well there's lots of the above I haven't done, but then again, I *have* done Maria Direct, Bonnie's Roof (direct), and The Dangler.

Roseland, for me, was more exciting than any of these. It got me pumped silly, and being on lead on hard climbing while being pumped scares the bejesus out of me.

Oh, and it's just one move, but I was certainly spooked on Directissima. I got completely pumped from protecting that traverse, and then couldn't get a full rest at the arete. So making the crux move protected by that horrible pin was pretty tough.

GO

Hi Coroner I always thought was fun. Not that bad if you just keep calm.

On DAFF Dome in Tuolumne there is a 5.9 on the face to the right of Crescent Arch that even now I won't touch, since it scares the living cr#p out of me (it averages 1 bolt a pitch, and thats all the gear that goes in (and the pitches are 100-150 ft long). , and I have started to solo in the 5.10d range.

Glad to hear I'm not the only one thinking that pin on Directissma needs to be replaced. I didn't find anything to back it up, but that might be due to pump and pucker.

Since the discussion has moved towards other areas, has anyone led Half-Moon Crack on Vertigo at Cannon? Am I going to die on this thing, or just get hurt real bad? Its already some of the most intimidating 5.9 climbing for me, and I've only seen pictures at this point.

Mike Donnelly
(BobbyS, check your PMs)

Half-Moon is not bad. I did it 30 years ago before cams and wearing EB's yada yada yada (well I did - so there). Seriously it is pretty solid - the last move where you have to reach up out of the crack to a bucket was a little iffy. If you are wicked skinny you can reach to the back and get some gear along the way. Alternatively you could just shell out the $$$ and buy a specialized big piece. Honestly we (I did it with a party of 3) thought the corner below it was harder.

Well, it depends on your OW technique! It's thuggish, grunty, 6" - 8" wide and about 75'(maybe less - the real business is about 40' long). It gets progressively harder (read: wider) as you go with the crux near the top of the pitch. If you have huge cams and/or Big Bros, it's not completely unprotected, but be prepared for a healthy run-out. There's a 9+ variation pitch in the dihedral off to the left - combo of friction, laybacking, and finger crack - pretty well protected, too. You also have the option of rapping off (since you're likely going to do that anyway after the next pitch, where the climb turns into 5.4 choss).

Ajax you out there?

I was hoping to get on it this season. My largest piece is a #4 Camalot. Anyone know - will I be hating life if I don't scrounge up a #5 or bigger, or if I did get the piece would it only turn a 40 foot runout into a 39 foot runout?

GO

When we did the FFA Bragg lead the Half Moon, so no pucker factor for me. I am not a big fan of using cracks to scape skin off my body futher up or down than my hands and forearms.
These days when I repeat Vertigo,I start up the Half Moon Crack about 8 feet up (there used to be a fixed pin here) I step blindly left a few feet and there is an awesome 9 or so fingercrack that is a wonderful alternative especially for wide crack non-lovers.

Awe, a little heel toe and a decent chicken wing and that is perfect protection

Back in the day, everyone did the Half Moon crack without fancy wide protection, because...there wasn't any. It's less than vertical and you fit in it fer God's sake, you're not gonna fall out. The worst that could happen, if your OW technique is super bad (and it would really have to be bad in this case, the pitch is pretty elementary), is that you won't be able to progress and will have to slide slowly back down to the start with your abraded tail between your legs.

Just do it.

rg, you walked to school up hill in both directions, didnt you...

Ajax - you do remember what happened to Steve Hendricks on it don't you?

I'm firmly with RG on this one. The Half Moon OW might be frustrating, but it's not the "exciting" adventure as some of the Gunks 5.9s mentioned previously. Sliding back down a wide crack is nothing like popping of of Wild Horses with nothing but some tiny RPs below your feet.

I haven't even tried Midnight Cowboy or Land's End, but what I've heard makes the zing in them sound louder by far than Vertigo.

Tell us! Tell us!

Hey RG - that makes sense, except for the exit move. If you get pumped like crazy on the OW, and then blow it in the exit move... it's a long ride.

You may not know it, but you're talking to someone who actually *likes* small offwidths, 'cause he can shuffle a cam up above him and stay on toprope all the time. I'm a pussy!

GO

I would agree with the crux pitch on Keep On Struttin.

Then there is Proctor Silex. One of my favorite 5.9's in the Gunks although I would not necessarily recommend it for the 5.9 leader.

Insulation just step, fun and exciting.

Comando Rave is very exciting and pumpy if you waste any time.

If you believe the 5.9+ on Beatle Brow Bulge then I does not get much more exciting than this although I would give this a 5.10.

The roof on Grim Ace Face although not 30 feet is not over immeditatly after the roof as there is some more climbing.

I also agree with Lands End as there really is not much time to relax on that one.

If you want some excitment and good climbing try the arch pitch on Elder Cleavage, but be carful with the gear.

I did not find Honky Tonk Woman all that exciting, just dangerous and uninteresting as previously stated.

Maria Direct on the other hand is a G rated boulder problem with the pin easily being backed up, you can get a good nut or red tricam in the v-shaped vertical crack and a bomber red camalot at the top of the crack in a horizontal pod.

Does the climbing have to be hard to be exciting? The second pitch of Le Teton after the initial moves off the deck and out to the arete (which are, I think, what spurred this thread) are not too hard, but they are darn exciting!

We're dealing with semantics here, I'd say. My point was that Le Teton was wildly exposed, pumpy, and just flat-out FUN! It was one of those perma-grin kinda climbs, where you finish with tha big smile that doesn't go away for a while. When I topped out, my friend who led it still had that smile on HIS face. A VERY ENJOYABLE 40 feet. How's that?

You've got it exactly! I drug my Yates #7 Big Dude (7") all the way up, and found it served as a backup to the pin at the start of the crack. Need a #3 BigBro - better to just go.

LeTeton was always one of my favorite 5.9's (last pitch is about 50') Sort of grabs your attention and does protect well.

In light of moving away from the Gunks and upping the grades a bit....Also very exciting on Cannon is Downeast at 5.10. The crux pitch is(was) sparsely protected, thin face climbing on the 5th pitch.

On Whitehorse check out The Ninth Wave, which back in the days of EBs, etc. was a 9.

Dizz

And harder than many of the 10's on Glacier Point Apron!

I enjoy Tim Kemple, Sr. telling of when his son wanted to get a good, early AM shot of Dad on the Half Moon Crack. After the first lead, he was asked to do it again and then again to get the right image. That's a lot of skin scraped away on one day.

Slopur is laughing to self thinking about this talk of 5.9. In Climbikstan, this is training grade for babies. No one really brag about climbing until it get very hardlike.....maybe 5.13. 5.9.....this funny business!! Like 5.9 ever be exciting...ha ha!!

SlopurLokov

SLOPUR! SLOPUR! SLOPUR!

Slopur, good to hear from you again. Are you related to Dr. Evil, er Kudos?