In what universe was that?
Yeah, Hans and Fritz were polite and asked around early on, but for the most part, it was pretty anti-authoritarian. Especially during the golden age.

Which is the real reason Skytop is closed.

Exactly, Marc; anti-authoritarian.

And yet, strictly authoritarian (to whom?) when it comes to sharing information on LC.

Irony, no? Glad you got the joke.

Lost City has also been the site of bolting activities which violate the Preserve's policy* That doesn't make it right either.

So I vote for no guidebook, Net-based or otherwise.

* Question for those active in the debate at the time - did the Preserve's "Thou shall not bolt anything anywhere" rule come AFTER the LC bolt war?

Iread the post over there and it seems rather absurd. The people who are claiming that it is "locals only club" are just plain lazy. I climbed there before I became a local. We just asked about that amazing looking cliff out there behind the steel bridge, and foun dout what it was. The next weekend, we wandered up the High Peterskill trail and fumbled aroun duntil we found a nice line to try. And yes, we toproped it because we sucked back then. Actually we still do suck, but I digress.

As far as the place not being adventure anymore? That's hooey too. 90% of the people who actually do climb there climb 2% of the routes. There is excellent climbing, even at moderate levels, that is clean, and free of chalk and fixed gear.

Having all of that documented takes nothing away from people who want everything mapped out for them. But it destroys the adventure for people who want to forge their own path. I have learned a lot about Lost City over the past 15 years, and every bit of it I have learned by wandering around out there, looking up, saying holy shit what's that!, tyring it, getting my ass handed to me, then trying it again. Sometimes I ask certain people who may know, sometimes I don't. It's my perogative. If you want documentation, go climb in the Trapps, The Nears, or.....egaads...Millbrook!

RR

route description: go up

How does publishing something take away from people who want to forge their own path? It doesn't. Nobody forces you to buy a guide book.

No document means you will not have the buckets of beta vomit thrown at you by every noob hooding a book starring up at the sky. The only time you get this experience at the Trapps is going there on a weekday...in the snow...at -15 temps..in Jan...um at night.

It's like bolting a route and then saying, well you don't have to use the bolts if you don't want to. Their simple presence alters the experience.

No, it's not the same at all.

Bolts give you empirical evidence that the route has been climbed. A guide book doesn't.

Just because a bible exists doesn't prove the existence of God.

And so you simply assume the beta-spouting gumby is delusional and talking to himself when he yells, "Dooood, there's a secret sidepull in the crack about halfway up and iIf you get that, you're golden!"