So I have been saving a bunch of routes for onsights in what I consider to be the best grade in the Gunks....5.10. Over the past 8-10 years I have turned down partners requests to follow up certain routes, in the hopes of someday being strong enough to lead them onsight.

Today I got on one of my "saved" routes, Doubleissima. I knew it was going to be sustained and pumpy, and tried to climb with a philosophy of put gear in quickly and committ to climbing well above gear. Man was I schooled hard! Sometimes the difference between the onsight and coming back to try to redpoint is one mistake. One fumbled gear placement. One wrong sequence. From there it is just a domino effect. I missed my treasured onsight of the route by mere fractions.

Oh well, it was still a great route to try to lead without any knowledge of. I felt like I wanted to puke when I topped out. I love that feeling.

So what routes are you saving for onsights? For me they are all in the 5.10 range. I haven't followed many 5.11's, so that grade isn't a big deal. Here's what I have left in the 5.10's to onsight:

Elder Cleavage
Ridiculissima
Erect Direction
Nurses Aid
Any 5.10 at Millbrook with the exception of Time Eraser
Tough Shift
Graveyard Shift
Interstice

What do you have, in any grade that you are climbing?

RR

where did you get pumped out Rob?

Sometimes I really think that saving routes just puts too much pressure on something that's supposed to be fun - I get too worked up just about the idea of them, and fussing over whether I'm really feeling good enough and whether I'm being too fussy about under exactly what conditions I'll try them and then oh, the pressure, what if all that saving up was just for nothing and I was fooling myself to think I'd ever be able to ....

But yeah, I do it too. Bonnie's and Roseland, guilty.

Let's not forget that if you've ever seen/watched someone on the route, or done routes to either side where you had a good view of the route in question, it's really not an "on sight".

Leading on sight trad is what climbing is all about.

tip:Erect Direction (my favorite on sight) is every bit as sustained as Doubleissima.

I think the modern definition of "onsight" is a silly adaptation of the rules for climbing competitions.

The old-fashioned idea ("trad onsight?"), was that whatever knowledge you acquired was obtained from the ground up and without weighting any gear. You could climb up, look around, downclimb and reclimb to your heart's content as long as you started at the bottom (no traversing in from the side or climbing down from the top to inspect) and didn't weight any gear.

Downclimbing out of trouble before falling is one of the great (and perhaps now fading) trad arts. The current sport-influenced definition of onsight misses the boat and encourages rushing upwards before you blow it.

I've tested the patience of many a partner running obligatory downclimbing laps.

I have a lousy memory, so everything is an onsight.

There are a lot of routes I've been saving for a lead. Funny thing is that by the time I was confident enough to lead them, there was something else I wanted to lead, so there's just a lot of classic, three star routes I've never been on and just haven't gotten around to climbing. Like Horseman, I got on it on TR for the first time last season to clean it; seemed a bit silly at that point to say "no, I want to onsight it".

Hey Rob, if you feel like you would try Doubleissima again you might as well give Ridiculissima a shot. It might be a little pumpier but the gear is mindless. I can never figure out which pitch I like better. I imagine you've done Stirrup Trouble if it's not on your list. Personally I think thats the best ten in the Gunks.(if only it were off the gt ledge)If Skytop were open I'd recommend October Country to you too. If Skytop were still open I'd really like to onsite No Comment.

I'm not sure what you think onsight now means? Your definition of what it "used to" mean is exactly what everyone I know considers it to mean. Unless I'm missing something.

What's the "sport influenced" version? By this do you mean that the climber always continues to either move up or fall? That's silly - that's just an onsight attempt with poor tactical skills. Milking rests and up and down-climbing to suss out a crux is just part of climbing, neither old- nor new-school.

Regarding the original topic - at the Gunks I preferred to attempt to onsight every climb that was challenging to me. This wasn't difficult logistically, since I consistently climbed with either people much weaker than I - who could at best follow the stuff I could lead, or people much stronger than I - who's leads I could at best follow.

These days, sadly, my only trad partners are weaker than I, and mostly less knowledgeable. So every hard climb I get on is an onsight attempt.

GO