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#61968 - 12/15/11 03:10 PM Re: Shawangunk Anchors - Wish Lists and Updates [Re: jakedatc]
SethG Offline
addict

Registered: 12/16/08
Posts: 680
Loc: NYC
I can't wrap my head around it.

A. It takes a lot of equipment and effort to install one of these cable anchors. This points to a guide being the likely culprit, although of course it isn't dispositive.

B. On the GT Ledge above Feast of Fools is such a butt-stupid place for such an anchor that it can't be a guide who installed it, right? And no guides are taking people up the second pitch of Feast, are they?
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#61970 - 12/15/11 03:36 PM Re: Shawangunk Anchors - Wish Lists and Updates [Re: tradjunkie]
jakedatc Offline
enthusiast

Registered: 10/18/06
Posts: 241
Chopping them would get whoever put them up out in the open pretty quick as they would probably start asking questions wink

that is a last resort north conway kinda solution though.

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#61973 - 12/15/11 04:09 PM Re: Shawangunk Anchors - Wish Lists and Updates [Re: jakedatc]
eparker_s Offline
journeyman

Registered: 03/16/11
Posts: 50
Well, I personally am talking about two separate beasts right now I believe. The anchor above feast of fools has been there a long, long time. Long enough to choke the tree. The other issue we are talking about is the sudden proliferation of these anchors. Separate issues in my mind, because of the difference in timing. Perhaps the same person has been installing these for years but?

I have actually met the fellow who was installing so many of these lately. It was late last season and my partner had met him before. He was heading out that day ( with considerable burden ) to install another anchor or two before weather moved in. At the time I took it at face value. I didn't even have an opinion on these anchors at the time. Anyway, he seemed like a hard working, well intentioned, community minded fellow out doing a good deed. As I recall the stated pro of the cable was that year after year you didn't have webbing piling up in huge tat anchors as people continued to add new web but failed to bring a knife and cut out any of the old. Basically a maintenance free anchor...

I am going to chop the cable above feast of fools, that is a big freaking tree to kill. But I am going to tie in new webbing. Contrary to Seth I think this anchor is available and useful, for example on a Saturday when tossing a rope down arrow will implicate you in a giant cluster F.

As for beginning to chop the rest? I'm not going to pretend I've got balls enough or even want the potential drama in my life to start that. Right now this is a one sided conversation with a few voices in agreement. The gunks climbing community is much larger than what is represented here and I think we need a little more input. That said I may also post up a little step by step tutorial for anyone interested after I take care of the Beast Feast Tree.

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#61975 - 12/15/11 04:19 PM Re: Shawangunk Anchors - Wish Lists and Updates [Re: jakedatc]
Doug Online   content
member

Registered: 12/29/06
Posts: 165
The Feast of Fools one is, I think, older (not these new French Weave ones). At least if it is the one I am thinking of (on the tree by the start of the last pitch of Easy V) it has been there for years while the new weaves seem to have sprouted over the last year. And according to another thread:
Quote:
The tree has grown out to the point that it is growing around the cable. At places the cable is at least a quarter inch imbedded in the bark of the tree. The two steel quick links are compressed between the tree and the cable.


Seems like that one should go as it is girdling the tree. I'm no arborist and I have no idea how it could be removed without hurting the tree, or if it is already too deep and the tree is doomed.

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#61976 - 12/15/11 04:43 PM Re: Shawangunk Anchors - Wish Lists and Updates [Re: Doug]
eparker_s Offline
journeyman

Registered: 03/16/11
Posts: 50
Yup that's the one I'm talking about chopping.
I believe I used the words "I'm no arborist" once when talking about this anchor
Anybody know an arborist? RR, don't you know a tree guy, you were going to ask about that other thing for me? Will ripping this thing out be counter productive? Maybe the best thing would be to remove the tension but not the cable itself?

At the same time I'm inclined to believe a tree can put up with a bit more abuse than what removing this would do.

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#61977 - 12/15/11 04:46 PM Re: Shawangunk Anchors - Wish Lists and Updates [Re: eparker_s]
jakedatc Offline
enthusiast

Registered: 10/18/06
Posts: 241
I will email my friend Tim.. he is an arborist and climber.

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#61978 - 12/15/11 05:11 PM Re: Shawangunk Anchors - Wish Lists and Updates [Re: jakedatc]
RangerRob Offline
Carpal Tunnel

Registered: 06/06/00
Posts: 3763
Loc: Ulster County, NY
Girdling a tree means cutting through the cambium layer of the tree. The cambium is where water and nutrients are transported, and it is a very thin layer right uner the bark, and outside the wood. If this layer is compromised around the entire diameter of the tree it is equivalent to pinching off someone's esophagus. The tree in question is a white pine (pinus strobus) I believe. It's a decent size, and the bark is on the thicker side in that species, unlike a black birch or red maple that has very thin bark. crushing the bark 1/4 to 1/2 inch all around my not yet be killing the tree, but it is certianly stressed, and will eventually die.

Removing the cable will enable the cambium to recover and start transporting nutrients the way it should. I don't see any harm in removing the cable. In fact, I think it should be removed, and I have a bolt cutter that would probably do the trick.

I'm no Arborist however......I'm just a gimp of a climber, so everything I say is suspect.

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#61979 - 12/15/11 05:18 PM Re: Shawangunk Anchors - Wish Lists and Updates [Re: RangerRob]
curmudgeon Online   content
addict

Registered: 10/27/10
Posts: 450
I hope an arbortrary concensus can be reached.

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#61980 - 12/15/11 05:28 PM Re: Shawangunk Anchors - Wish Lists and Updates [Re: curmudgeon]
Doug Online   content
member

Registered: 12/29/06
Posts: 165
I wasn't positive girdling was the proper term - but when searching for effects of a tight cable on a tree I found a discussion that seemed to indicate that is what eventually happens with a cable as the tree grows.

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#61981 - 12/15/11 05:34 PM Re: Shawangunk Anchors - Wish Lists and Updates [Re: curmudgeon]
eparker_s Offline
journeyman

Registered: 03/16/11
Posts: 50
Arbortrary! Lol.
Rob, you are either just as much the nerd you appear to be or the best bullshitter known to man. But there ain't no way you getting a bolt cutter in there. EMBEDDED cable. It's luck that the nuts on the clamp are facing outward.

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