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#58041 - 06/17/11 03:49 PM Re: 17 DOLLARS!?!?!?!?! [Re: tradjunkie]
whatthegunks Offline
member

Registered: 05/09/09
Posts: 136
Loc: High Falls, NY
It does not seem that long ago (five or six years ago?) that Rich Gottleib's wife had her car window smashed and bag stolen at the Stairmaster lot. There have been a number of times over the years that cars were getting broken into, periods where some jackass random(s) or other were doing the smash and go. Walking out of the Stairmaster yesterday I passed a pick up with a cap/mobile doss that had a whole array of gear strewn about in it and I thought, damn that's a trusting soul. Having Preserve staff down there and around in general has got to be a deterrent to ne'er-do-wells.

Of course the Preserve is adding staff at trail heads to be sure to collect funds for passes. It should be noted that MP is PRIVATE land, it was bought by the Smiley family over the course of decades and that the trust was created to protect the land not the perceived rights of one or another user group. We are incredibly lucky to have access to the Gunks and some humility about it all rather than indignant ranting seems to make sense.

Drink the Kool-Aid, Stoopid!

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#58050 - 06/17/11 07:51 PM Re: 17 DOLLARS!?!?!?!?! [Re: tradjunkie]
stoopid Offline
journeyman

Registered: 10/09/08
Posts: 67
Loc: West Sand Lake, NY
Originally Posted By: tradjunkie
Originally Posted By: Rickster

Stoopid, how does the MP not show respect and appreciation to it's members and day visitors, particularly climbers?


Anybody know what proportion of day permits are climbers, what proportion of members are climbers? By which I mean have climbing passes. Or what proportion of total visit-days are by climber-privileged visitors?


The mystery wrapped therein is part of the issue. It's a prevailing attitude I see every now and then. I come from a hiking background, in which the user group is literally catered to. For whatever reason (I'm guessing stigma/prejudice/stereotypes) climbers seem to be looked down upon and discarded.

On a side note unrelated to Mohonk -- someone I know overheard the owner of the store at the bottom of the hill (Bistro?) say that "most of [their] business does not come from climbers". Are they for friggin real? I know when I'm in there early it's nothing BUT climbers, buying sandwiches (their breakfast sandwiches are awesome and filling) and drinks for the day. The person either has a serious beef with climbers (would not be a first as I've personally seen/experienced this), they only think poorly dressed dirtbags are climbers, or they live in a parallel universe. As a working mid-career professional I must look and smell like a hiker to them. lol


Edited by stoopid (06/17/11 08:04 PM)

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#58051 - 06/17/11 07:56 PM Re: 17 DOLLARS!?!?!?!?! [Re: whatthegunks]
stoopid Offline
journeyman

Registered: 10/09/08
Posts: 67
Loc: West Sand Lake, NY
Originally Posted By: whatthegunks
It does not seem that long ago (five or six years ago?) that Rich Gottleib's wife had her car window smashed and bag stolen at the Stairmaster lot. There have been a number of times over the years that cars were getting broken into, periods where some jackass random(s) or other were doing the smash and go. Walking out of the Stairmaster yesterday I passed a pick up with a cap/mobile doss that had a whole array of gear strewn about in it and I thought, damn that's a trusting soul. Having Preserve staff down there and around in general has got to be a deterrent to ne'er-do-wells.

Of course the Preserve is adding staff at trail heads to be sure to collect funds for passes. It should be noted that MP is PRIVATE land, it was bought by the Smiley family over the course of decades and that the trust was created to protect the land not the perceived rights of one or another user group. We are incredibly lucky to have access to the Gunks and some humility about it all rather than indignant ranting seems to make sense.


Of the breakins, I assume the staff were colelcting fees as they normally do, 'patroling' the same points of entry as they normally do? Was their presence critical in preventing those breakins? Need a bit more info, we're trying to build a case for the guards being more than just ticket collectors.

It seems that the use of "private" in this thread is suppose to bring me in line with the "you should be thanking them" mentality I guess I'm supposed to have. But I pay a fee for access, so who should be thanking who? What would they be doing with this land otherwise? Is this not the best use of 1.5 miles of climbing wall? What other grand design could they have possibly executed with the trapps? So, really, spare me the sentimentality. If they were giving it away for free I could see it.


Edited by stoopid (06/17/11 07:57 PM)

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#58054 - 06/17/11 08:14 PM Re: 17 DOLLARS!?!?!?!?! [Re: stoopid]
stoopid Offline
journeyman

Registered: 10/09/08
Posts: 67
Loc: West Sand Lake, NY
Just a fyi, with no disrespect intended to anyone participating, I'm going to excuse myself from the discussion. I feel like I'm spinning my wheels and it's probably best to just move on and spend the internet time doing other things.

Maybe I'll meet you all someday at the crag.

Kevin

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#58057 - 06/17/11 11:33 PM Re: 17 DOLLARS!?!?!?!?! [Re: stoopid]
Mike Rawdon Offline

Carpal Tunnel

Registered: 11/29/99
Posts: 4276
Loc: Poughkeepsie
Originally Posted By: stoopid


On a side note unrelated to Mohonk -- someone I know overheard the owner of the store at the bottom of the hill (Bistro?) say that "most of [their] business does not come from climbers". Are they for friggin real? I know when I'm in there early it's nothing BUT climbers, buying sandwiches (their breakfast sandwiches are awesome and filling) and drinks for the day. The person either has a serious beef with climbers (would not be a first as I've personally seen/experienced this), they only think poorly dressed dirtbags are climbers, or they live in a parallel universe. As a working mid-career professional I must look and smell like a hiker to them. lol


I'm guessing you don't happen by there the other 5 days of the week. Or at lunch times. Yes, climbers mob the place Sat and Sun mornings, but the local blue collar folks are what their base business appears to be about (based on what I've seen).

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#58058 - 06/18/11 02:30 AM Re: 17 DOLLARS!?!?!?!?! [Re: Mike Rawdon]
chip Offline
Carpal Tunnel

Registered: 10/06/01
Posts: 2679
Loc: Sittin' Pretty in Fat City
Maybe if the Preserve raised the day fees we could get rid of the rif-raf!



OK, I'm kiddin', sorta.

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#58063 - 06/18/11 09:08 AM Re: 17 DOLLARS!?!?!?!?! [Re: Mike Rawdon]
stoopid Offline
journeyman

Registered: 10/09/08
Posts: 67
Loc: West Sand Lake, NY
Originally Posted By: Mike Rawdon
I'm guessing you don't happen by there the other 5 days of the week. Or at lunch times. Yes, climbers mob the place Sat and Sun mornings, but the local blue collar folks are what their base business appears to be about (based on what I've seen).


That's very possible. It didn't occur to me that anyone other than visitors would frequent their establishment considering it's pretty far off the path from New paltz and any other larger towns in the area. Seems like a long way for locals to go to get a cup of coffee, and there aren't enough residents living nearby to support it by themselves...

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#58064 - 06/18/11 11:29 AM Re: 17 DOLLARS!?!?!?!?! [Re: stoopid]
Welle Offline
enthusiast

Registered: 11/03/08
Posts: 213
Loc: Western Slope
Originally Posted By: stoopid
It didn't occur to me that anyone other than visitors would frequent their establishment considering it's pretty far off the path from New paltz and any other larger towns in the area.


New Paltz is not the only town in the area...

Originally Posted By: stoopid
and there aren't enough residents living nearby to support it by themselves...


Ha, the MPNA would like you to think otherwise...

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#58071 - 06/18/11 06:44 PM Re: 17 DOLLARS!?!?!?!?! [Re: Welle]
TerrieM Online   content
addict

Registered: 05/14/09
Posts: 426
Loc: Gunks in Summer, Southwest in ...
I got a ride from someone yesterday who was coming from New Paltz to grab a sandwich at the Deli. It turned out his friend worked there, and he was visiting him on his day off, but... there ya go!

And though it may seem like "all climbers" at 8am on a weekend - what exactly does a "climber look like?" Might it be that some of those people are also hikers or bikers? And....I spend some time on the Deli wi-fi during weekday afternoons. Plenty of non-outdoorsy people stop in there. Also - this region has a pretyy big, dispersed, population. There are little smatterings of houses dotting the place in miles each direction. Also - Hwy 44/55 is a MAJOR thoroughfare over the ridge. Truck drivers pull into the lot kitty corner often.

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#58088 - 06/20/11 02:46 AM Re: 17 DOLLARS!?!?!?!?! [Re: Welle]
Advocacy group Offline
addict

Registered: 08/03/10
Posts: 653
Loc: New Paltz,Marbletown,Gardiner,...
Originally Posted By: Welle
Originally Posted By: stoopid
It didn't occur to me that anyone other than visitors would frequent their establishment considering it's pretty far off the path from New paltz and any other larger towns in the area.


New Paltz is not the only town in the area...

Originally Posted By: stoopid
and there aren't enough residents living nearby to support it by themselves...


Ha, the MPNA would like you to think otherwise...



First off, the Mohonk Preserve (formerly Mohonk Trust) was created long before any sort of housing or tourist boom in ulster county happened and in fact was created because the Mountain House was having financial problems. Much of the land would exist as open space as it does today mainly because most of the land that the Mohonk Preserve owns is inaccessible or very hard to develop. Look at the ridge as it currently exists, not a single ridge top house despite much of the land being in private hands. Even with all of the houses "on the ridge" most are hidden when looked at from the flats. Even the night time view is void of house lights with the exception of the Mountain House and Smiley tower. Welle is correct that the local economy alone could not support the Mohonk Preserve, the bloated salary of Glenn Hoagland and the ever growing public relations department that has unsuccessfully tried to drown out the many voices of the neighbors of the Mohonk Preserve makes sure of that.

Thanks,MPNA
_________________________
The MPNA is an advocacy group for adjacent neighbors of the Mohonk Preserve. In the event of a dispute with the Mohonk Preserve, we can offer assistance in obtaining experts in the following areas; Surveying, Lawyers, Title, expert witnesses, ancient document research, and Maps.

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