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#64142 - 04/24/12 12:20 AM Re: New campground planned [Re: Advocacy group]
Advocacy group Offline
addict

Registered: 08/03/10
Posts: 653
Loc: New Paltz,Marbletown,Gardiner,...
GARDINER — Susan Lewis seems almost surprised by the environmental fight she's engaged in.

She's an environmentalist herself, a member and supporter of the Mohonk Preserve.

But these days she finds herself questioning some critical aspects of a proposed campground that would abut her property on Marakill Lane. The 50-site campground is being proposed by the Palisades Interstate Park Commission. It would be managed by the preserve. The proposed Shawangunk Gateway Campground abuts the property of seven other homes in the shadow of the Shawangunk Ridge.

Lewis would like to see alcohol banned from the site and enforceable limits placed on the number of people who can use it. The project could become reality by the end of the year.

But most of all, she'd like to see the proposal come under the jurisdiction of the local Planning Board. But that's something that, to Lewis' dismay, the PIPC says isn't going to happen.

The PIPC is not subject to local laws, it says.

"It's a bit frightening to me that we have no formal mechanism to ensure that whatever agreements we come to with the PIPC will be enforceable in the future," she said.

If this were a private development, she said, the builders would need a special permit from the town to proceed.

Lewis recently forwarded a petition with 150 signatures to town officials. She and her lawyer have met twice with the PIPC's executive director, James Hall, to try and resolve the issues. But Hall said Tuesday the commission's position isn't about to change.

"As a state entity, we're not subject to local laws, any more than when the state wants to build a road through state-owned land," he said. "It's a question of state sovereignty."

To do otherwise, such as agree to a deed restriction as Lewis has proposed, would be tantamount, Hall said, to granting private property owners control over state land.

As for formally limiting alcohol consumption, he said that rather than forbid it, the site's managers would monitor any inappropriate behavior. He also said that the site would not be rented out for large-scale parties as Lewis and other property owners fear.
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The MPNA is an advocacy group for adjacent neighbors of the Mohonk Preserve. In the event of a dispute with the Mohonk Preserve, we can offer assistance in obtaining experts in the following areas; Surveying, Lawyers, Title, expert witnesses, ancient document research, and Maps.

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#64143 - 04/24/12 12:26 AM Re: New campground planned [Re: Advocacy group]
Advocacy group Offline
addict

Registered: 08/03/10
Posts: 653
Loc: New Paltz,Marbletown,Gardiner,...
As per the last meeting, the Mohonk Preserve was unwilling to drop the idea of the pavillion. The pavillion would have some kind of sound system for mass gatherings. As far as we could tell tje idea of renting it out was still on the table. This is certainly not the low impact 50 campsite proposal that was envisioned in 2002.

Thanks, MPNA
_________________________
The MPNA is an advocacy group for adjacent neighbors of the Mohonk Preserve. In the event of a dispute with the Mohonk Preserve, we can offer assistance in obtaining experts in the following areas; Surveying, Lawyers, Title, expert witnesses, ancient document research, and Maps.

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#64144 - 04/24/12 02:32 AM Re: New campground planned [Re: Advocacy group]
GuilfordGang Offline
stranger

Registered: 04/23/12
Posts: 15
Loc: Currently Boston Area
This is unfortunate.

After my initial post I did more digging and found the original site plan. I saw that and thought, "What's the big deal?" I would have been fine with the original incarnation of the SGC. It looked like a mostly quiet mixed walk/drive in site that would perhaps at worst create only occasional commotion. A rowdy night at the campfire before heading home and the like.

I am also curious what documentation can be found about the number and size of sites and facilities at the proposed SGC with the new plan.

Does anyone have a link to a PDF of the new plan that the PIPC/MP is proposing? If this is a State backed project then it should be public info. I couldn't find it.

Funny how a simple campground has been possibly corrupted into a potential problem for those of us in the area.

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#64145 - 04/24/12 02:54 AM Re: New campground planned [Re: GuilfordGang]
Advocacy group Offline
addict

Registered: 08/03/10
Posts: 653
Loc: New Paltz,Marbletown,Gardiner,...
Originally Posted By: GuilfordGang
This is unfortunate.

After my initial post I did more digging and found the original site plan. I saw that and thought, "What's the big deal?" I would have been fine with the original incarnation of the SGC. It looked like a mostly quiet mixed walk/drive in site that would perhaps at worst create only occasional commotion. A rowdy night at the campfire before heading home and the like.

I am also curious what documentation can be found about the number and size of sites and facilities at the proposed SGC with the new plan.

Does anyone have a link to a PDF of the new plan that the PIPC/MP is proposing? If this is a State backed project then it should be public info. I couldn't find it.

Funny how a simple campground has been possibly corrupted into a potential problem for those of us in the area.


One of the tactics that the Mohonk Preserve uses is to try and divide the neighbors so there is less opposition. They've tried this numerous times. The best thing to do is to get in contact with Susan and get more neighbors involved from around the Mohonk Preserve. Sign the petition that is circulating, get involved, go to the meetings and get your voice heard. If you would like, we can help with getting you in contact with other neighbors.

MPNA
_________________________
The MPNA is an advocacy group for adjacent neighbors of the Mohonk Preserve. In the event of a dispute with the Mohonk Preserve, we can offer assistance in obtaining experts in the following areas; Surveying, Lawyers, Title, expert witnesses, ancient document research, and Maps.

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#64147 - 04/24/12 09:57 AM Re: New campground planned [Re: Advocacy group]
oenophore Online   confused
Carpal Tunnel

Registered: 09/24/01
Posts: 5979
Loc: 212 land
If the proposed campground would be any more than a well-policed place to crash and cook without an open fire, I'd be opposed if I were to live nearby.
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#64148 - 04/24/12 10:51 AM Re: New campground planned [Re: oenophore]
Advocacy group Offline
addict

Registered: 08/03/10
Posts: 653
Loc: New Paltz,Marbletown,Gardiner,...
Originally Posted By: oenophore
If the proposed campground would be any more than a well-policed place to crash and cook without an open fire, I'd be opposed if I were to live nearby.


That sums up the feelings of the majority of the neighbors. It's a real shame that the Mohonk Preserve is trying to shove this expansive, bloated and high impact project on its neighbors. The neighbors concerns have been more than reasonable. Please write to the Mohonk Preserve and explain that the campground as proposed is unacceptable.

Thanks, MPNA
_________________________
The MPNA is an advocacy group for adjacent neighbors of the Mohonk Preserve. In the event of a dispute with the Mohonk Preserve, we can offer assistance in obtaining experts in the following areas; Surveying, Lawyers, Title, expert witnesses, ancient document research, and Maps.

Top
#64149 - 04/24/12 01:58 PM Re: New campground planned [Re: Advocacy group]
oenophore Online   confused
Carpal Tunnel

Registered: 09/24/01
Posts: 5979
Loc: 212 land
Please write to the Mohonk Preserve and explain that the campground as proposed is unacceptable.

Since I don't know exactly what is proposed, I'll reserve my opinion of the proposal.
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#64150 - 04/24/12 02:30 PM Re: New campground planned [Re: oenophore]
GuilfordGang Offline
stranger

Registered: 04/23/12
Posts: 15
Loc: Currently Boston Area
I've scoured the Internet trying to find more info about the modified plans. Nothing is available, not even from NYS parks or state.gov sites. Just the original ~50-ish site PDF. That means either it's being hidden, the plans are not done yet, or it is stalled at some point along the way.

I'm already planning to write Cuomo, Gardiner officials and the PIPC to state my concerns and request information. I wish I could attend a Gardiner meeting, but it's 8 hours round trip for me, not to mention gas and tolls.

This campground is creating a problem for us, we've already invested a lot of time and money for BOH, engineering and architectural services needed to build on our land. We'd hoped for a small, quiet place in the woods. If this campground were to go through in it's bloated incarnation I don't think my other half would want to continue with the process. We have a small child and the last thing we need is a transient, mobile kegger less then a quarter mile away. We'd be taking a loss on the investment, plus losing a dream spot in the forest.

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#64151 - 04/24/12 03:20 PM Re: New campground planned [Re: GuilfordGang]
ianmanger Offline
enthusiast

Registered: 04/25/03
Posts: 319
concur re plan.. The pavilion has always been in the plans and its purpose isn't clear, except that it has showers. I couldn't find anything else, even in local papers, most likely this is another piece of AG misdisinfo.

that said. its the drumming that gets me. I don't know why people have to go out in the 'wilderness' and fucking drum. Even with a onsite manager enforcing 'quiet' hours this would be a PITA. And I'm going to agree with Chris (yes!) that this doesn't appear to be being done by by the PIPC engaging effectively with the locals and that blows bigtime.




Originally Posted By: GuilfordGang
I've scoured the Internet trying to find more info about the modified plans. Nothing is available, not even from NYS parks or state.gov sites. Just the original ~50-ish site PDF. That means either it's being hidden, the plans are not done yet, or it is stalled at some point along the way.

I'm already planning to write Cuomo, Gardiner officials and the PIPC to state my concerns and request information. I wish I could attend a Gardiner meeting, but it's 8 hours round trip for me, not to mention gas and tolls.

This campground is creating a problem for us, we've already invested a lot of time and money for BOH, engineering and architectural services needed to build on our land. We'd hoped for a small, quiet place in the woods. If this campground were to go through in it's bloated incarnation I don't think my other half would want to continue with the process. We have a small child and the last thing we need is a transient, mobile kegger less then a quarter mile away. We'd be taking a loss on the investment, plus losing a dream spot in the forest.

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#64153 - 04/24/12 03:54 PM Re: New campground planned [Re: ianmanger]
GuilfordGang Offline
stranger

Registered: 04/23/12
Posts: 15
Loc: Currently Boston Area
Lol, re: drumming

Yeah, I'm guilty of enjoying that when I was younger, BUT, it was with many people of similar mind, so everyone was ok with it. Plus there was nobody nearby to affect with the noise.

I've written a letter to Gardiner officials, FWIW. From what I can gather their influence on the matter is limited due to who owns the land. Here it is:

Edit: Odd, the site is clipping my paste after the first paragraph. Maybe because I'm posting from a mobile device.


Edited by GuilfordGang (04/24/12 03:59 PM)

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