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#65303 - 06/06/12 03:05 AM Re: Son of easy o rap [Re: TrappDyke]
rg@ofmc Offline
Pooh-Bah

Registered: 12/25/99
Posts: 2467
Loc: Poughkeepsie, NY
TD, two bolts is not the question here and never was the question here, so there is nothing for you to be baffled about.

Surely you know that bolting would be a Preserve decision, and they are understandably reluctant to multiply the anchors they are already responsible for. In any case, I think they've learned enough not to put a bolted anchor directly above a popular route, so replacing the current SOEO anchor with bolts is an exceptionally remote possibility and rightly so.

Nowadays, the best way off of SOEO is to traverse over to the ledge with the City Lights rap bolts. This avoids the top and uses bolts already in place.

I did suggest moving the current SOEO anchor over above Hether if there are cracks available for that---by now I would have checked myself if my knee wasn't wracked up, but alas, I can't do that right now. That anchor location would keep people off the top, keep down-traffic from interfering with up-traffic on SOEO, eliminate SOEO top-roping, and open up Hether for top-roping, an excellent route that most people do not want to lead. Seems like win-win for everyone if it is possible.

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#65309 - 06/06/12 03:53 PM Re: Son of easy o rap [Re: rg@ofmc]
empicard Offline
Carpal Tunnel

Registered: 08/29/01
Posts: 2954
Loc: LI, NY
I say we just pour concrete and add proper drainage at the top of the cliff.
_________________________
tOOthless

Time flies like an arrow. Fruit flies like a banana.

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#65311 - 06/06/12 04:29 PM Re: Son of easy o rap [Re: Bill]
OldEric Offline
newbie

Registered: 05/20/02
Posts: 48
Originally Posted By: Bill
Quote:
by a bunch of self-riotous topropers.


Yeah. Brings back some awful memories. One moment Eric and I are standing there minding our own business and the next minute we are swept up in a maelstrom of self-riotous topropers. Some of the bruises are still healing. I do believe Eric's recent surgery was a result of the beating we took that day, but then I might be wrong. I often am. grin


I on the other hand - am never wrong. Spell check on the however..

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#65322 - 06/07/12 12:34 PM Re: Son of easy o rap [Re: OldEric]
RangerRob Offline
Carpal Tunnel

Registered: 06/06/00
Posts: 3764
Loc: Ulster County, NY
Here is my two cents on the issue. The anchor is going to keep reappearing there regardless of what we want or why we argue one way or the other. Everyone makes good theoretical points, and I can see the logic in both sides. But the reality that we already know is that people are now used to there being an anchor there. If it is completely cleaned, then something else is going to show up there. for that reason alone, I tend to agree with cleaning up all the old mank, and reinstalling a good anchor with webbing as opposed to cables.

I do think organizing a work crew to go up and get rid of all those loose rocks would be the better community action. Yes, they will roll down with erosion and rain again, but they can easily be removed again and again. If that is the real danger, then why not deal with that, instead of the anchor? That's what is going to get a third party injured or killed, not the presence or absence of a convenience anchor. We don't have to do any labor intensive water bars or erosion control measures. We're not looking for a permanent solution. Yearly maintenance, (and really not that difficult at all) is all that is required to to keep the rocks from the drop zone.

Anyone want to go up there with me some afternoon during the week with a couple of bags and help me get that crap out of there?

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#65328 - 06/07/12 04:28 PM Re: Son of easy o rap [Re: RangerRob]
wombat Offline
member

Registered: 05/27/08
Posts: 147
Loc: gardiner
Why is everyone so convinced that it will re-appear? Other than guides, how many people climb it so many times each year that they need to spend their time and treasure building a permanent TR/Rap anchor?

Why would you invest in a convenience anchor for gumbies? its not like it is really performing a valuable public service like Dick's stairs.

Lets chop it a few times and see how often it comes back.

I dont know how effective the bag o rocks approach will be but if someone is concerned about safety, it makes alot of sense to solve the actual risk, not the anchor.

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#65330 - 06/07/12 05:07 PM Re: Son of easy o rap [Re: RangerRob]
Dana Offline
addict

Registered: 07/13/00
Posts: 619
Rob, I sent you a message.

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#65335 - 06/07/12 11:02 PM Re: Son of easy o rap [Re: Dana]
rg@ofmc Offline
Pooh-Bah

Registered: 12/25/99
Posts: 2467
Loc: Poughkeepsie, NY
Me too.

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#65443 - 06/12/12 03:10 PM Re: Son of easy o rap [Re: rg@ofmc]
Julie Offline
Pooh-Bah

Registered: 01/16/00
Posts: 2090
Loc: SoCal
@Jason, if you're looking for practice pulling pins: There's a way-old pin about 4' above ground level, something like 20' right of Twin Oaks. It's in the little mound in front of the cliff.

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#65472 - 06/15/12 02:55 AM Re: Son of easy o rap [Re: Julie]
worthrussell Offline
journeyman

Registered: 04/11/10
Posts: 90
Loc: NY, Brooklyn
Ive climbed Son of easy o around 8-10 times this season. I tend to use it as a good start for the day. I very rarely, if ever, see groups tring the route. Fact is whether fixed rapp anchors are in place or not the groups the wanna top rope will continue to do so. I as a new climber who doesn't have the wisdom of the old school ethics value safety over all else. All other points are secondary. Rebuild it, drill it and the old douchers who wanna top it out do so. As an added bonus they can rain rocks on the self righteous lazy top ropers who are just dying to drag their feet up the start and polish the start a little more.

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#65473 - 06/15/12 05:14 AM Re: Son of easy o rap [Re: worthrussell]
rg@ofmc Offline
Pooh-Bah

Registered: 12/25/99
Posts: 2467
Loc: Poughkeepsie, NY
Originally Posted By: worthrussel
Fact is whether fixed rapp anchors are in place or not the groups the wanna top rope will continue to do so.

That's nonsense. A fixed anchor will generate far more top-roping than if there is none there. In any case, this particular argument is now moot, because the original fixed anchor has now been replaced with a new one, in the same place.

Originally Posted By: worthrussel
I as a new climber who doesn't have the wisdom of the old school ethics value safety over all else. All other points are secondary.

Here's some of that wisdom: you don't get safety from fixed rappel anchors. If anything, they decrease safety by promoting rappelling, which has been a major cause of accidents recently. And this particular anchor doesn't even satisfy what passes for modern "wisdom," since it sends rappelling parties down the ascent route. But the arguments have been made and the anchor is back in business, so that's that.

Originally Posted By: worthrussel
...the old douchers who wanna top out [can] do so. As an added bonus they can rain rocks on the self righteous lazy top ropers who are just dying to drag their feet up the start and polish the start a little more.

Well, the old douchers are going to have to work a lot harder at raining rocks (not that they ever did). Here's what the top of Easy O looked like around 5 o'clock on Thursday:



and here's what it looked like an hour or so later:



Not visible is the fact that the ledge below the top has also been cleaned up. We're guessing this will last the season, but maybe a little work like this twice a year would be even better.

As the thread above reveals, this was RangerRob's idea, who, although not an old doucher, seems to have enough wisdom to realize that the best way to fix a problem is to...fix the problem. The good ranger and I needed perhaps a bit over an hour to do this work plus the cleanup of the ledge below that can't be seen in the photos. It ain't that hard, folks.

Note: no lazy self-righteous top-ropers were harmed during this cleanup, because we didn't knock anything off.

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