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#67199 - 01/14/13 03:03 AM Do you have what it takes to live ...?
donald perry Offline
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Registered: 06/27/11
Posts: 1536
Loc: New Jersey
Incredible skill, do you have what it takes to live to die another day?

This is a video of my recent ice trip in Colorado. After I realized I was on camera [Crap!] I went back and did it again, this time without the rope. I was able to dry tool it. Unfortunately the people were not very enthusiastic and did not care about shooting another shot----posting this shot instead, without my consent. Not very nice.

The video is below:

"Mountain climber saved at last second ..."




The moral of the story: If you don't climb like me, you won't be shooting me because you won't be ABLE to be holding the camera without having a mental meltdown. [/quote]
_________________________
The Mohonk Mountain House and the Mohonk Preserve have done a great job protecting the environment thus far, but ... it's all down hill from here http://youtu.be/9AU8fMo8v4k.

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#67200 - 01/14/13 10:51 AM Re: Do you have what it takes to live ...? [Re: donald perry]
Mike Rawdon Offline

Carpal Tunnel

Registered: 11/29/99
Posts: 4276
Loc: Poughkeepsie
Who are you quoting here? Are you representing yourself as the lucky climber in that now well-known video?

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#67201 - 01/14/13 07:50 PM Re: Do you have what it takes to live ...? [Re: Mike Rawdon]
donald perry Offline
veteran

Registered: 06/27/11
Posts: 1536
Loc: New Jersey
Yes, I am reliving the moment. I do not claim to be perfect, however I know how to learn from my mistakes.
_________________________
The Mohonk Mountain House and the Mohonk Preserve have done a great job protecting the environment thus far, but ... it's all down hill from here http://youtu.be/9AU8fMo8v4k.

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#67203 - 01/14/13 10:55 PM Re: Do you have what it takes to live ...? [Re: donald perry]
oenophore Offline
Carpal Tunnel

Registered: 09/24/01
Posts: 5981
Loc: 212 land
From that video, it seems what it takes to live is a willingness to accept a toprope when things get dicey.
_________________________

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#67206 - 01/15/13 05:12 AM Re: Do you have what it takes to live ...? [Re: oenophore]
donald perry Offline
veteran

Registered: 06/27/11
Posts: 1536
Loc: New Jersey
No, I came to my senses and realized I over reacted. The second time around I prepared myself to down climb it on the good ice ------that I was in such a hurry to leave behind----if I did not make it up. I should not have been in such a hurry, that was my big mistake. But the rock is low angle, and not completely smooth, so I made it up, no problem.


Edited by donald perry (01/15/13 05:25 AM)
_________________________
The Mohonk Mountain House and the Mohonk Preserve have done a great job protecting the environment thus far, but ... it's all down hill from here http://youtu.be/9AU8fMo8v4k.

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#67208 - 01/15/13 04:23 PM Re: Do you have what it takes to live ...? [Re: donald perry]
SethG Offline
old hand

Registered: 12/16/08
Posts: 714
Loc: NYC
Don, are you saying you overreacted by accepting the top rope? I saw that video the first time it made the rounds, and then as now I was very happy you accepted the offer of help! My experience on ice is very limited but to my non-expert eyes it seems like the biggest reason for regret in connection with this incident is your choice of which line to lead that day!
_________________________
It's true, I have a blog. http://climbandpunishment.blogspot.com/

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#67209 - 01/15/13 04:31 PM Re: Do you have what it takes to live ...? [Re: donald perry]
Adrian Offline
journeyman

Registered: 03/12/09
Posts: 73
Originally Posted By: donald perry
No, I came to my senses and realized I over reacted. The second time around I prepared myself to down climb it on the good ice ------that I was in such a hurry to leave behind----if I did not make it up. I should not have been in such a hurry, that was my big mistake. But the rock is low angle, and not completely smooth, so I made it up, no problem.

I'm so confused. The first time you climbed it, the ice was melting away and you almost got the chop. So the second time, you don't even bother with ice, just solo the rock?

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#67210 - 01/15/13 04:39 PM Re: Do you have what it takes to live ...? [Re: Adrian]
Rickster Online   content
old hand

Registered: 10/16/07
Posts: 853
Loc: Orange Cty, NY
This whole incident/event/episode took place at least last season, the vid was posted last July, so it's not at all "recent". The account is incomplete and what info there is remains confused. Why bring it up now except to be out trolling about? crazy

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#67218 - 01/16/13 04:01 AM Re: Do you have what it takes to live ...? [Re: Rickster]
donald perry Offline
veteran

Registered: 06/27/11
Posts: 1536
Loc: New Jersey
This post is not meant to be about trolls and trolling, ultimately it is not even meant to be about me at all , I am sorry you got that impression. What I would like to know, what I am trying to think about, and what this post is really about is this:

Seriously, what do you [you guys] think about what would be the *Idea* of doing *The Right Thing* at that point? In other words, what would you have done? Would you be up for the challenge or would you bail … how would you asses the situation and how would you have dealt with the elements. If I did the wrong thing … what would you have done. Would you have been up on that ice? Now when I ask this question, I hope we are not going to talk about "It depends". I am not sure that real sentence anyway. If it depends, than I would ask what would it depend on. Perhaps you would say, I would not have gotten myself into that kind of a situation to begin with. Very well, suppose it was not possible to go back down for any number of reasons? What would you have done at the point that you came over the top of that ridge on not so OK ice, and then you found it was low angle. How would you have handled the situation from there? Could you handle that situation, or would you have just jumped up on that surf board and hoped for the best? These things can happen, can't they?, that things can start out nice and end up not so nice?

If the conclusion is to accept the rope, what is that all about?, how do you feel about that?, would you consider that a mistake there? I am Just making conversation, try not to get too bent out of shape.
_________________________
The Mohonk Mountain House and the Mohonk Preserve have done a great job protecting the environment thus far, but ... it's all down hill from here http://youtu.be/9AU8fMo8v4k.

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#67220 - 01/16/13 10:42 AM Re: Do you have what it takes to live ...? [Re: donald perry]
oenophore Offline
Carpal Tunnel

Registered: 09/24/01
Posts: 5981
Loc: 212 land
If the conclusion is to accept the rope, what is that all about?, how do you feel about that?, would you consider that a mistake there? I am Just making conversation, try not to get too bent out of shape.

If the toprope were not accepted, would this conversation be taking place?
_________________________

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#67222 - 01/16/13 03:01 PM Re: Do you have what it takes to live ...? [Re: donald perry]
Adrian Offline
journeyman

Registered: 03/12/09
Posts: 73
I don't think anyone has a problem with you taking that rope. In fact, most if not all people glad that you did.

I think just about anyone who ice climb has a problem with you being on that route given the condition it was in. But since I wasn't there, I don't know the detail of what makes you decided to climb that route when it's clearly falling down.

So if you want to talk about mistakes. The mistake isn't that you took the rope, it's that you were climbing the falling ice route in the first place.

BTW, what did you say to your belayer after the climb?

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#67225 - 01/16/13 06:37 PM Re: Do you have what it takes to live ...? [Re: oenophore]
donald perry Offline
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Registered: 06/27/11
Posts: 1536
Loc: New Jersey
No.
_________________________
The Mohonk Mountain House and the Mohonk Preserve have done a great job protecting the environment thus far, but ... it's all down hill from here http://youtu.be/9AU8fMo8v4k.

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#67226 - 01/16/13 06:44 PM Re: Do you have what it takes to live ...? [Re: Adrian]
donald perry Offline
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Registered: 06/27/11
Posts: 1536
Loc: New Jersey
Originally Posted By: Adrian
I don't think anyone has a problem with you taking that rope. In fact, most if not all people glad that you did.

I think just about anyone who ice climb has a problem with you being on that route given the condition it was in. But since I wasn't there, I don't know the detail of what makes you decided to climb that route when it's clearly falling down.

So if you want to talk about mistakes. The mistake isn't that you took the rope, it's that you were climbing the falling ice route in the first place.


I think you are entirely correct. I had no business being on the route in the first place, I was a fool to even try it. However, I do think it would have been quite safe for a more experienced climber, no?
_________________________
The Mohonk Mountain House and the Mohonk Preserve have done a great job protecting the environment thus far, but ... it's all down hill from here http://youtu.be/9AU8fMo8v4k.

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#67228 - 01/16/13 08:32 PM Re: Do you have what it takes to live ...? [Re: donald perry]
RangerRob Offline
Carpal Tunnel

Registered: 06/06/00
Posts: 3765
Loc: Ulster County, NY
Donald I think the experience would serve not to enable a climber to ascend such an obviously dangerous condition, but to avoid it entirely.

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#67230 - 01/16/13 08:35 PM Re: Do you have what it takes to live ...? [Re: donald perry]
chip Online   content
Carpal Tunnel

Registered: 10/06/01
Posts: 2679
Loc: Sittin' Pretty in Fat City
Warm ice is always alluring because it is so easy to get everything to stick, until the ice falls down. You are certainly not the first to mis-judge how soon it was coming down. Thankfully, you did not join some others in dying over making a poor choice. Accepting the rope was the only realistic option once you were in that situation and a "more experienced" climber would have fared no better given the conditions you found. The water chute you were in did not appear to lend itself to dry tooling or anything other than water/ice sliding once the ice stopped being climbable.

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#67231 - 01/16/13 08:38 PM Re: Do you have what it takes to live ...? [Re: RangerRob]
donald perry Offline
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Registered: 06/27/11
Posts: 1536
Loc: New Jersey
Yes, but what if the climb was long and the weather changed and going down would be worse than going up? What would you do then?
_________________________
The Mohonk Mountain House and the Mohonk Preserve have done a great job protecting the environment thus far, but ... it's all down hill from here http://youtu.be/9AU8fMo8v4k.

Top
#67233 - 01/16/13 09:02 PM Re: Do you have what it takes to live ...? [Re: donald perry]
retroscree Offline
enthusiast

Registered: 06/29/11
Posts: 397
O
Originally Posted By: donald perry
Yes, but what if the climb was long and the weather changed and going down would be worse than going up? What would you do then?

Since you're now in totally hypothetical-land, I'd have tapped my communicator and had Scotty beam me up.

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#67234 - 01/16/13 09:10 PM Re: Do you have what it takes to live ...? [Re: retroscree]
RangerRob Offline
Carpal Tunnel

Registered: 06/06/00
Posts: 3765
Loc: Ulster County, NY
Donald unless you're on a multi day alpine ice route, the weather doesn't that fast to turn an otherwise good route into a river

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#67236 - 01/16/13 10:02 PM Re: Do you have what it takes to live ...? [Re: donald perry]
Mike Rawdon Offline

Carpal Tunnel

Registered: 11/29/99
Posts: 4276
Loc: Poughkeepsie
Donald, you haven't answered my first question - why is there a quote tag in your initial post? Whose statement(s) are you quoting?

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#67240 - 01/17/13 01:31 AM Re: Do you have what it takes to live ...? [Re: Mike Rawdon]
donald perry Offline
veteran

Registered: 06/27/11
Posts: 1536
Loc: New Jersey
Originally Posted By: Mike Rawdon
Donald, you haven't answered my first question - why is there a quote tag in your initial post? Whose statement(s) are you quoting?


The [/quote] comes from some left over code I used before on another post. I never bothered to remove it here. The way I make linkable photo's is I hit the quote button on an existing post that has a photo-link and code in it to youtube and a photo. I can then scoop up the code and reuse it. All I then have to do is change the links to a new youtube video and photo.

There is no plagiarism involved with what I wrote, the words are all my own. As for the video[s], they do not belong to me, they are all over the internet with no one taking credit for them. I have nothing whatsoever to do with it in any way shape or form, other than a link. Presently I am making hypothetical arguments about the scenario.
_________________________
The Mohonk Mountain House and the Mohonk Preserve have done a great job protecting the environment thus far, but ... it's all down hill from here http://youtu.be/9AU8fMo8v4k.

Top
#67241 - 01/17/13 01:32 AM Re: Do you have what it takes to live ...? [Re: RangerRob]
donald perry Offline
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Registered: 06/27/11
Posts: 1536
Loc: New Jersey
Originally Posted By: RangerRob
Donald unless you're on a multi day alpine ice route, the weather doesn't that fast to turn an otherwise good route into a river


I do not belive that is true. What about the Eiger? I know that these days people can do it in a few hours. But suppose you were off to do it in a few days? Arn't there accounts of these kind of things happening there?


Edited by donald perry (01/17/13 01:34 AM)
_________________________
The Mohonk Mountain House and the Mohonk Preserve have done a great job protecting the environment thus far, but ... it's all down hill from here http://youtu.be/9AU8fMo8v4k.

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#67242 - 01/17/13 01:35 AM Re: Do you have what it takes to live ...? [Re: retroscree]
donald perry Offline
veteran

Registered: 06/27/11
Posts: 1536
Loc: New Jersey
Originally Posted By: retroscree
O
Originally Posted By: donald perry
Yes, but what if the climb was long and the weather changed and going down would be worse than going up? What would you do then?

Since you're now in totally hypothetical-land, I'd have tapped my communicator and had Scotty beam me up.


Why? Don't you ice climb?
_________________________
The Mohonk Mountain House and the Mohonk Preserve have done a great job protecting the environment thus far, but ... it's all down hill from here http://youtu.be/9AU8fMo8v4k.

Top
#67243 - 01/17/13 01:39 AM Re: Do you have what it takes to live ...? [Re: chip]
donald perry Offline
veteran

Registered: 06/27/11
Posts: 1536
Loc: New Jersey
Originally Posted By: chip
Warm ice is always alluring because it is so easy to get everything to stick, until the ice falls down. You are certainly not the first to mis-judge how soon it was coming down. Thankfully, you did not join some others in dying over making a poor choice. Accepting the rope was the only realistic option once you were in that situation and a "more experienced" climber would have fared no better given the conditions you found. The water chute you were in did not appear to lend itself to dry tooling or anything other than water/ice sliding once the ice stopped being climbable.


What about prying off the ice first?, it would not take much. And ... you can see some horizontal edges even in the video.
_________________________
The Mohonk Mountain House and the Mohonk Preserve have done a great job protecting the environment thus far, but ... it's all down hill from here http://youtu.be/9AU8fMo8v4k.

Top
#67247 - 01/17/13 02:02 AM Re: Do you have what it takes to live ...? [Re: RangerRob]
donald perry Offline
veteran

Registered: 06/27/11
Posts: 1536
Loc: New Jersey
Originally Posted By: RangerRob
Donald unless you're on a multi day alpine ice route, the weather doesn't that fast to turn an otherwise good route into a river


True, but then like I said before, lets suppose we are talking about that.

"There was one problem, however. The brilliantly sunny weather melted much of the ice that held the upper rocks in place, with the result that rockfall was heaver that usual." Eiger: Wall of Death by Arthur Roth Page 132.
_________________________
The Mohonk Mountain House and the Mohonk Preserve have done a great job protecting the environment thus far, but ... it's all down hill from here http://youtu.be/9AU8fMo8v4k.

Top
#67248 - 01/17/13 02:26 AM Re: Do you have what it takes to live ...? [Re: donald perry]
Mike Rawdon Offline

Carpal Tunnel

Registered: 11/29/99
Posts: 4276
Loc: Poughkeepsie
Originally Posted By: donald perry

There is no plagiarism involved with what I wrote, the words are all my own. As for the video[s], they do not belong to me, they are all over the internet with no one taking credit for them. I have nothing whatsoever to do with it in any way shape or form, other than a link. Presently I am making hypothetical arguments about the scenario.



OK, now I'm really confused. This is all "hypothetical"?

Sounds like OJ Simpson's book...

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#67249 - 01/17/13 03:19 AM Re: Do you have what it takes to live ...? [Re: Mike Rawdon]
donald perry Offline
veteran

Registered: 06/27/11
Posts: 1536
Loc: New Jersey
Well, I was talking about what we are talking about now, right now. However if you want to take it further you can do that too. But like I said before, my post is not about me, it is about a question. Do you have an answer?
_________________________
The Mohonk Mountain House and the Mohonk Preserve have done a great job protecting the environment thus far, but ... it's all down hill from here http://youtu.be/9AU8fMo8v4k.

Top
#67251 - 01/17/13 02:45 PM Re: Do you have what it takes to live ...? [Re: donald perry]
Rickster Online   content
old hand

Registered: 10/16/07
Posts: 853
Loc: Orange Cty, NY
What would I have done? I'd have been off the route before the sun hit the face. It worked for the gracious folks that lowered you the rope.

However, from what we see in the vid, it looks as if you were attempting to get to top by the shortest route, via that patch of thin ice. I appears to me as if the ice to climbers right was a not as lean, a quick step right and up, you'd have made it clean. This looks to be exactly what you did once on top rope. Sometimes the shortest route isn't the direct one.

Otherwise, cleaning the loose, thin ice to clean rock, would have been my best move, given that it would not endanger my belayer, or others below.

Salvation from such situations can come in many forms. 25+ years ago, while walking along the base of the Trapps, I heard a climber named Don Hamilton recite a short prayer as he was leading up on tenuous pro.

"Oh Lord, please put Joel Ponti in my place."

In such situations, one must do , what one must do.

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#67253 - 01/17/13 03:31 PM Re: Do you have what it takes to live ...? [Re: donald perry]
AOR Offline
enthusiast

Registered: 08/27/04
Posts: 392
Originally Posted By: donald perry
This climber is not me. But hypothetically speaking, it were you, would you have taken the rope without reserve? or tried to work out a solution first for a period of time? I think much of went wrong here had to do with haste, and taking the rope so quickly only came naturally as what had been the from the very beginning. If there was no earnest need to get to the top immediately none of this would have happened in the first place. I suppose likewise one could always think about waiting till the sun set and the ice refreeze again.


Donald, now I'm REALLY confused. First you said you were the climber in the video and now (above) you say you are not. Are you, or are you NOT the climber in the video?
Please explain and/or clarify...

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#67255 - 01/17/13 04:02 PM Re: Do you have what it takes to live ...? [Re: donald perry]
donald perry Offline
veteran

Registered: 06/27/11
Posts: 1536
Loc: New Jersey
This climber is not me. But hypothetically speaking, if it were you, would you have taken the rope without reserve? or tried to work out a solution for a period of time … as long as possible?

Over and over again I read about all that has to do with such a happy ending to such a desperate situation as this, with ice! But I think all of went wrong, all of it here has to do with haste. And taking the rope so quickly as only came naturally to what had been from the very beginning was just another mistake determined by the errors governing the principles of the method used to ascend. Man's nature to search for quick easy and "safe" solutions. Which all, when taken together are not safe at all. In my mind, ultimately, this has to be just another error, no solution found and no solution attempted, and nothing gained. If there was no earnest need to get to the top immediately, then none of this would have happened in the first place. I suppose likewise one could always think about waiting till the sun set and the ice refreeze again where it is possible to hang on a dry tool.

Ultimately when you get down to the nifty gritty, I think climbing is not for the faint hearted or the week or for those who are looking for quick easy and safe solutions. It's a man's game, you can die or you can kill your partner, it is not safe. Good thing the belayer did not come off the top and the rope held, she was not even done with her anchors yet.

When you can't take the heat when the ice begins to melt, then it must only get worse. And this I think is the real problem, and that has everything with not taking or not taking the rope from above. What happened that day had nothing to do with climbing.
_________________________
The Mohonk Mountain House and the Mohonk Preserve have done a great job protecting the environment thus far, but ... it's all down hill from here http://youtu.be/9AU8fMo8v4k.

Top
#67256 - 01/17/13 04:10 PM Re: Do you have what it takes to live ...? [Re: donald perry]
Rickster Online   content
old hand

Registered: 10/16/07
Posts: 853
Loc: Orange Cty, NY
Don said..... "This climber is not me. But hypothetically speaking......."

Don please reread all of your posts in this thread. Identify all the sentences that you posted that indicate that you are the climber in question.
This thread has been an intentional farce from the very beginning, can you honestly say you have not been playing the troll? whistle


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#67257 - 01/17/13 04:18 PM Re: Do you have what it takes to live ...? [Re: donald perry]
Adrian Offline
journeyman

Registered: 03/12/09
Posts: 73
Originally Posted By: donald perry
This climber is not me. But hypothetically speaking, if it were you, would you have taken the rope without reserve? or tried to work out a solution for a period of time
...do with climbing

LOL, Don totally mind fucked everyone!

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#67259 - 01/17/13 08:43 PM Re: Do you have what it takes to live ...? [Re: Rickster]
retroscree Offline
enthusiast

Registered: 06/29/11
Posts: 397
Don, why the hell didn't you just post your basic discussion question instead of wrapping it the suggestion/implication that you were the climber in that vid? It's annoying, juvenile, egocentric, and ultimately dilutes what you were trying to discuss. I doubt anyone cares any longer about your hypothetical musings at this point.

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#67260 - 01/17/13 10:15 PM Re: Do you have what it takes to live ...? [Re: donald perry]
TerrieM Online   content
addict

Registered: 05/14/09
Posts: 426
Loc: Gunks in Summer, Southwest in ...
I'm confused.... Are you the climber in the video, or not?

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#67261 - 01/17/13 10:46 PM Re: Do you have what it takes to live ...? [Re: TerrieM]
anthonyb Offline
newbie

Registered: 10/21/08
Posts: 38
Loc: Paris, France
Originally Posted By: TerrieM
I'm confused.... Are you the climber in the video, or not?


Clearly not.

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#67263 - 01/18/13 03:29 AM Re: Do you have what it takes to live ...? [Re: anthonyb]
Lucander Offline
enthusiast

Registered: 04/03/09
Posts: 227
Loc: Stone Ridge, NY
I vote the OP to be speaker of the House - he is still more grounded in reality than the man present filling that seat.

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#67268 - 01/18/13 05:44 PM Re: Do you have what it takes to live ...? [Re: Lucander]
SethG Offline
old hand

Registered: 12/16/08
Posts: 714
Loc: NYC
I'm guessing it is Don, but he is now sorry he told us so.
_________________________
It's true, I have a blog. http://climbandpunishment.blogspot.com/

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#67276 - 01/18/13 08:31 PM Re: Do you have what it takes to live ...? [Re: SethG]
Rickster Online   content
old hand

Registered: 10/16/07
Posts: 853
Loc: Orange Cty, NY
I had my doubts. The voice doesn't match and the fellow in the video has a bigger nose. Not Don.

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#67279 - 01/18/13 09:39 PM Re: Do you have what it takes to live ...? [Re: Rickster]
crimpy Offline
enthusiast

Registered: 07/02/11
Posts: 331
Loc: Wawarsing

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#67280 - 01/18/13 10:51 PM Re: Do you have what it takes to live ...? [Re: crimpy]
oenophore Offline
Carpal Tunnel

Registered: 09/24/01
Posts: 5981
Loc: 212 land
Brilliant reply, Crimpy. laugh
_________________________

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#67282 - 01/19/13 12:56 AM Re: Do you have what it takes to live ...? [Re: oenophore]
Rickster Online   content
old hand

Registered: 10/16/07
Posts: 853
Loc: Orange Cty, NY
Ooops, I guess Don has the bigger nose.

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#67284 - 01/19/13 02:19 PM psych 101 [Re: Rickster]
Valpine Offline
journeyman

Registered: 06/29/10
Posts: 55
Loc: W.Sand Lake, NY
Why must some people always be the center of attention?

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#67285 - 01/19/13 05:22 PM Re: psych 101 [Re: Valpine]
oenophore Offline
Carpal Tunnel

Registered: 09/24/01
Posts: 5981
Loc: 212 land
Is that a rhetorical question? Do you propose an answer?
_________________________

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#67286 - 01/19/13 08:45 PM Re: psych 101 [Re: oenophore]
Valpine Offline
journeyman

Registered: 06/29/10
Posts: 55
Loc: W.Sand Lake, NY
I seek an answer from the master.

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#67287 - 01/20/13 03:46 AM Re: Do you have what it takes to live and die ... [Re: Valpine]
donald perry Offline
veteran

Registered: 06/27/11
Posts: 1536
Loc: New Jersey
Originally Posted By: Don
This post is not meant to be about trolls and trolling, ultimately it is not even meant to be about me at all , I am sorry you got that impression. What I would like to know, what I am trying to think about, and what this post is really about is this:

Seriously, what do you [you guys] think about what would be the *Idea* of doing *The Right Thing* at that point? In other words, what would you have done? Would you be up for the challenge or would you bail … how would you asses the situation and how would you have dealt with the elements. If I did the wrong thing … what would you have done. Would you have been up on that ice? Now when I ask this question, I hope we are not going to talk about "It depends". I am not sure that real sentence anyway. If it depends, than I would ask what would it depend on. Perhaps you would say, I would not have gotten myself into that kind of a situation to begin with. Very well, suppose it was not possible to go back down for any number of reasons? What would you have done at the point that you came over the top of that ridge on not so OK ice, and then you found it was low angle. How would you have handled the situation from there? Could you handle that situation, or would you have just jumped up on that surf board and hoped for the best? These things can happen, can't they?, that things can start out nice and end up not so nice?

If the conclusion is to accept the rope, what is that all about?, how do you feel about that?, would you consider that a mistake there? I am Just making conversation, try not to get too bent out of shape.


Please re-read my previous posts again. You are confused at this point because of all the commotion, the thread is about you, and your opinion, I am waiting for it to answer whatever it is that you might have to say on the subject. As I said before repeatedly, the thread is not meant to be about me, I am sorry you got that impression. Do you have an answer?
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The Mohonk Mountain House and the Mohonk Preserve have done a great job protecting the environment thus far, but ... it's all down hill from here http://youtu.be/9AU8fMo8v4k.

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#67288 - 01/20/13 03:48 PM Re: Do you have what it takes to live and die ... [Re: donald perry]
oenophore Offline
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Hmm; why the change in title?
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#67289 - 01/20/13 07:48 PM Re: Do you have what it takes to lie ...? [Re: oenophore]
Doug Offline
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Registered: 12/29/06
Posts: 176
There, now I changed it to better fit the thread

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#67290 - 01/21/13 12:23 AM Re: Do you have what it takes to lie ...? [Re: Doug]
oenophore Offline
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Nah, we all have what it takes.
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#67291 - 01/21/13 01:11 AM Re: Do you have what it takes to lie ...? [Re: oenophore]
donald perry Offline
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You can't handle the truth, So now can we please get back on topic?

This post is not meant to be about trolls and trolling, ultimately it is not even meant to be about me at all , I am sorry you got that impression. What I would like to know, what I am trying to think about, and what this post is really about is this:

Seriously, what do you [you guys] think about what would be the *Idea* of doing *The Right Thing* at that point? In other words, what would you have done?


Edited by donald perry (01/21/13 01:21 AM)
_________________________
The Mohonk Mountain House and the Mohonk Preserve have done a great job protecting the environment thus far, but ... it's all down hill from here http://youtu.be/9AU8fMo8v4k.

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#67292 - 01/21/13 03:07 AM Re: Do you have what it takes to lie ...? [Re: donald perry]
mummert Offline
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Registered: 11/16/99
Posts: 97
Loc: Danbury, CT, USA
I find that Thibault cancels out Capa Ferro. Don't you?

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#67293 - 01/21/13 03:28 AM Re: Do you have what it takes to lie ...? [Re: donald perry]
AOR Offline
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Posts: 392
Originally Posted By: donald perry


You can't handle the truth, So now can we please get back on topic?

This post is not meant to be about trolls and trolling, ultimately it is not even meant to be about me at all , I am sorry you got that impression. What I would like to know, what I am trying to think about, and what this post is really about is this:

Seriously, what do you [you guys] think about what would be the *Idea* of doing *The Right Thing* at that point? In other words, what would you have done?


Don...it's over.
Please, for the love of sanity...move on. Nothing is making any sense. No one is going to respond to whatever perceived "point" you're trying to make, prove, justifiy, or explain.
Whatever argument you were trying to expound on has ended...it's ended. Period. Please let this die.

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#67294 - 01/21/13 06:35 AM Re: Do you have what it takes to lie ...? [Re: AOR]
donald perry Offline
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OK fine, I will not post any more complaints to off topic posts, except one more. AOR, you are off topic, if you want to post I think that's fine, but please make it about serious ice climbing problems next time, thanks.


Edited by donald perry (01/21/13 06:56 AM)
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#67295 - 01/21/13 03:17 PM Re: Do you have what it takes to lie ...? [Re: donald perry]
ianmanger Offline
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Wait, you're complaining about off-topic posts? Want to put this under "ice climbing" and maybe start a separate "serious" subtopic so we don't get it confused with everyday ice climbing problems.
Stronger meds, too.


Originally Posted By: donald perry
OK fine, I will not post any more complaints to off topic posts, except one more. AOR, you are off topic, if you want to put I think that's fine, but please make it about serious ice climbing problems next time, thanks.

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#67296 - 01/21/13 05:21 PM Re: Do you have what it takes to lie ...? [Re: donald perry]
AOR Offline
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Posts: 392
Originally Posted By: donald perry
OK fine, I will not post any more complaints to off topic posts, except one more. AOR, you are off topic, if you want to post I think that's fine, but please make it about serious ice climbing problems next time, thanks.


Don,
This is respectfully submitted to you...
I was desperately trying to do you a favor. Please look past the purported attack you perceived I was committing, as I wasn't. I was simply suggesting that you end your quest for whatever answer(s) you were seeking in this thread.

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#67297 - 01/21/13 06:39 PM Re: Do you have what it takes to lie ...? [Re: AOR]
retroscree Offline
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#67307 - 01/22/13 11:00 PM Re: Do you have what it takes to lie ...? [Re: retroscree]
RangerRob Offline
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Donald you clearly stated in your first post that that video was of you. You also clerly stated that the people who shot the video did not have your permission to post images of you online. Now you're telling us that it isn't you? Either you're emabarrassed about putting yourself in that situation now, or you are fabricating the whole thing in order to troll people online. Is there another option here?

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#67308 - 01/23/13 04:24 AM Re: Do you have what it takes to lie ...? [Re: RangerRob]
donald perry Offline
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OK, I will be honest. When I first saw that video it was a few days ago. After I saw it, I do not know if you had the same reaction I did, but I was pissed off. I own a company and, for example, if I saw some of my workers belaying before being tied in, filming before someone was tied in, climbing without protection on something like that and falling off I would be pretty pissed off. Heads would roll. These are the kinds of things that go through the mind of a business owner, any business owner not just me. They get pissed off when they see these kinds of things. Not to mention, if you have seen the responding posts, they are not very encouraging toward ice climbing in general. I am sure these kinds of posts do not do much for helping ice climbing around Peterskill Falls. So why is it here on youtube? I suppose these people must be proud of themselves? There is no reason for ice climbing to be like that [the climber could not even make it up with a rope] and like you said, it does not have to be, unless you are on something like the Eiger off season. So why is the video online? Perhaps it does some good to encourage other would be fatalities to think again and back off, so there is good in it.

OK, so now, when I posted the video and wrote

Quote:
Incredible skill, do you have what it takes to live to die another day? This is a video of my recent ice trip in Colorado. After I realized I was on camera [Crap!] I went back and did it again, this time without the rope. I was able to dry tool it. Unfortunately the people were not very enthusiastic and did not care about shooting another shot----posting this shot instead, without my consent. Not very nice. "


what I was trying to do was sarcastically impersonate the climber in the video with some critical analysis. I thought it was obvious, who would boast about incredible skill while making a complete jackass out of themselves on line, but I guess there are people out there who just believe there are people who are inexperienced and proud of it, and that I was that man. Although I have never met anyone like that myself. Maybe there are people out there who wanted to believe that the man in the video finally had a voice. You can see from the first lines that the post is meant to be sarcastic, "Incredible skill?". But rather then believe it was sarcastic people understood it to be a confession of insanity, so I played the part. The first question I would have asked is: "Why did you post incredible skill?, you had none, you have none! Do you think this is the apex of man meets ice?".

So is there a third option? I think there is, I was being sarcastic. It was not my intention to be annoying. It was not as serious a post initially as people made it out to be.

But there are a lot of questions I believe that can be explored here that I do not know if anyone has brought up yet, I was trying to get to them, but it never happened. In that respect it would have nice to have been the guy in the video, it would have made for some interesting conversations. Too bad it never really happened, in that regard. If my objective was to trying impersonate the guy, I would have done it from an anonymous account, but I don't have the time for that.

_________________________
The Mohonk Mountain House and the Mohonk Preserve have done a great job protecting the environment thus far, but ... it's all down hill from here http://youtu.be/9AU8fMo8v4k.

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#67309 - 01/23/13 04:30 AM Re: Do you have what it takes to lie ...? [Re: donald perry]
donald perry Offline
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RUSSIANS SUCCESSFULLY SIEGE K2'S HARDEST LINE


Lindsay Griffin

Posted on: September 5, 2007

http://www.alpinist.com/media/web07f/k2_west.jpg
_________________________
The Mohonk Mountain House and the Mohonk Preserve have done a great job protecting the environment thus far, but ... it's all down hill from here http://youtu.be/9AU8fMo8v4k.

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#67310 - 01/23/13 10:35 AM Re: Do you have what it takes to lie ...? [Re: donald perry]
oenophore Offline
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what I was trying to do was sarcastically impersonate the climber in the video

So here is a case of sarcasm taken on its face. Is it due to poor expression or poor interpretation by its readers?
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#67311 - 01/23/13 03:41 PM Re: Do you have what it takes to lie ...? [Re: oenophore]
chip Online   content
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I find it very hard to interpret sarcasm from online writing. It makes me appreciate the writers who have done it so well in books and magazines for so long. Without the inflections of the voice I think most of us have trouble conveying much of the humor and irony we would like to share.

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#67312 - 01/23/13 04:46 PM Re: Do you have what it takes to lie ...? [Re: chip]
oenophore Offline
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Originally Posted By: chip
I find it very hard to interpret sarcasm from online writing. It makes me appreciate the writers who have done it so well in books and magazines for so long. Without the inflections of the voice I think most of us have trouble conveying much of the humor and irony we would like to share.
Well put. I, for one, would do well to sharpen my rhetorical skill before attempting to write sarcasticly or satirically. (I don't intend this as a slight toward Mr. Perry.)
One tact is to write something so outrageous as to convince the reader that it must be sarcastic or satirical, much as Jonathan Swift did in his A Modest Proposal.
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#67313 - 01/23/13 09:26 PM Re: Do you have what it takes to lie ...? [Re: donald perry]
retroscree Offline
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Registered: 06/29/11
Posts: 397
Originally Posted By: donald perry
So why is the video online?

Because it's gripping to watch. That's all. No lessons, no food for thought, no introspection.

Originally Posted By: donald perry
Quote:
Incredible skill, do you have what it takes to live to die another day? This is a video of my recent ice trip in Colorado. After I realized I was on camera [Crap!] I went back and did it again, this time without the rope. I was able to dry tool it. Unfortunately the people were not very enthusiastic and did not care about shooting another shot----posting this shot instead, without my consent. Not very nice. "


what I was trying to do was sarcastically impersonate the climber in the video with some critical analysis. I thought it was obvious, who would boast about incredible skill while making a complete jackass out of themselves on line, but I guess there are people out there who just believe there are people who are inexperienced and proud of it, and that I was that man. Although I have never met anyone like that myself. Maybe there are people out there who wanted to believe that the man in the video finally had a voice. You can see from the first lines that the post is meant to be sarcastic,...

No, most couldn't, frankly because you don't have the writing ability to adequately convey that.

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#67314 - 01/23/13 10:12 PM Re: Do you have what it takes to lie ...? [Re: retroscree]
donald perry Offline
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Then why did you say it was hypothetical? You wrote: "Since you're now in totally hypothetical-land, I'd have tapped my communicator and had Scotty beam me up."

How hard do you think that section is anyway without a rope? If someone will help pay my airfare when it gets slushy, I'll give it a go on video, it does not look that hard, does it? I would like to see it dry tooled.
_________________________
The Mohonk Mountain House and the Mohonk Preserve have done a great job protecting the environment thus far, but ... it's all down hill from here http://youtu.be/9AU8fMo8v4k.

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#67315 - 01/23/13 10:29 PM Re: Do you have what it takes to lie ...? [Re: donald perry]
TerrieM Online   content
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What the post looked like, to me, was that you were trying to pull off that it was, in fact, yourself in the video. Which was very strange, since most who knew who you are and had seen the video knew the two aren't the same. My thought was (yes, I was thinking, but not in the lines you might have intended) "Why is he lying?"

One accepted and easy way to convey sarcasm on an the internet is to use tags. Before the post, you make this little sign: <sarcasm). And then when you finish writing, you put this little sign: </sarcasm). Or, you can do this: (end sarcastic rant).

Just a tip for those who find themselves wondering....

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#67316 - 01/24/13 03:30 AM Re: Do you have what it takes to lie ...? [Re: TerrieM]
donald perry Offline
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.


Edited by donald perry (01/24/13 04:20 AM)
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The Mohonk Mountain House and the Mohonk Preserve have done a great job protecting the environment thus far, but ... it's all down hill from here http://youtu.be/9AU8fMo8v4k.

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#67317 - 01/24/13 04:20 AM Re: Do you have what it takes to lie ...? [Re: donald perry]
donald perry Offline
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I don't think Shakespeare nor would have Juliet used signs for "Romeo, Romeo, Where art thou, Romeo?" It would not be very romantic.


Edited by donald perry (01/24/13 04:22 AM)
_________________________
The Mohonk Mountain House and the Mohonk Preserve have done a great job protecting the environment thus far, but ... it's all down hill from here http://youtu.be/9AU8fMo8v4k.

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#67318 - 01/24/13 10:25 AM Re: Do you have what it takes to lie ...? [Re: donald perry]
oenophore Offline
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Originally Posted By: donald perry
I don't think Shakespeare nor would have Juliet used signs for "Romeo, Romeo, Where art thou, Romeo?" It would not be very romantic.
So Juliet spoke sarcastically then, eh?
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#67319 - 01/24/13 02:54 PM Re: Do you have what it takes to lie ...? [Re: donald perry]
retroscree Offline
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Originally Posted By: donald perry
I don't think Shakespeare nor would have Juliet used signs for "Romeo, Romeo, Where art thou, Romeo?" It would not be very romantic.

1. Do you know what this passage means?
2. WTF does this have to do with your tortured logic in this thread where you're not even able to follow what you said in your own posts?

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#67320 - 01/24/13 03:57 PM Re: Do you have what it takes to lie ...? [Re: oenophore]
donald perry Offline
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Originally Posted By: oenophore
Originally Posted By: donald perry
I don't think Shakespeare nor would have Juliet used signs for "Romeo, Romeo, Where art thou, Romeo?" It would not be very romantic.
So Juliet spoke sarcastically then, eh?


"Spoke" is past tense, but I said "would have", which is future tense.
_________________________
The Mohonk Mountain House and the Mohonk Preserve have done a great job protecting the environment thus far, but ... it's all down hill from here http://youtu.be/9AU8fMo8v4k.

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#67321 - 01/24/13 04:09 PM Re: Do you have what it takes to lie ...? [Re: retroscree]
donald perry Offline
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Originally Posted By: retroscree
Originally Posted By: donald perry
I don't think Shakespeare nor would have Juliet used signs for "Romeo, Romeo, Where art thou, Romeo?" It would not be very romantic.

1. Do you know what this passage means?
2. WTF does this have to do with your tortured logic in this thread where you're not even able to follow what you said in your own posts?


I am following [answering] RangerRob's post at this point, he wants me to answer what the topic is, was, and should be. And you never answered my question.


Edited by donald perry (01/24/13 04:12 PM)
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The Mohonk Mountain House and the Mohonk Preserve have done a great job protecting the environment thus far, but ... it's all down hill from here http://youtu.be/9AU8fMo8v4k.

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#67322 - 01/24/13 05:04 PM Re: Do you have what it takes to lie ...? [Re: donald perry]
Mike Rawdon Offline

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[quote=donald perry"Spoke" is past tense, but I said "would have", which is future tense. [/quote]

Bzzzt! "Would have" is the conditional past tense. Future tense is "will (do)".

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#67323 - 01/24/13 06:29 PM Re: Do you have what it takes to lie ...? [Re: Mike Rawdon]
donald perry Offline
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Originally Posted By: Mike Rawdon
[quote=donald perry"Spoke" is past tense, but I said "would have", which is future tense.


Bzzzt! "Would have" is the conditional past tense. Future tense is "will (do)". [/quote]

Bzzzt! Counterfactual conditional. Hypothetically a condition that is known to be false, or presented as unlikely, and here on two counts.


Edited by donald perry (01/24/13 06:34 PM)
_________________________
The Mohonk Mountain House and the Mohonk Preserve have done a great job protecting the environment thus far, but ... it's all down hill from here http://youtu.be/9AU8fMo8v4k.

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#67324 - 01/24/13 08:35 PM Re: Do you have what it takes to lie ...? [Re: donald perry]
crimpy Offline
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#67325 - 01/24/13 10:00 PM Re: Do you have what it takes to lie ...? [Re: donald perry]
Mike Rawdon Offline

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Originally Posted By: donald perry
Originally Posted By: Mike Rawdon
[quote=donald perry"Spoke" is past tense, but I said "would have", which is future tense.


Bzzzt! "Would have" is the conditional past tense. Future tense is "will (do)".


Bzzzt! Counterfactual conditional. Hypothetically a condition that is known to be false, or presented as unlikely, and here on two counts. [/quote]

I was referring to the main clause only and stand by my statement. "Would have" is not future tense.

[/grammar police]

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#67326 - 01/24/13 10:47 PM Re: Do you have what it takes to lie ...? [Re: Mike Rawdon]
donald perry Offline
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If the "would have" is an impossibility, then it is a counterfactual conditional. And if it is possible then it is a conditional past tense.

You are saying it is possible when it's not, or at least not likely which would make it counterfactual.


Edited by donald perry (01/24/13 10:53 PM)
_________________________
The Mohonk Mountain House and the Mohonk Preserve have done a great job protecting the environment thus far, but ... it's all down hill from here http://youtu.be/9AU8fMo8v4k.

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#67328 - 01/25/13 10:35 AM Re: Do you have what it takes to lie ...? [Re: donald perry]
oenophore Offline
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Gosh almighty -- what a &&*^&%^%$@#$ thread! crazy
I nominate Crimpy as its most sensible contributor.
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#67329 - 01/25/13 03:04 PM Re: Do you have what it takes to lie ...? [Re: oenophore]
donald perry Offline
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The rise of differences is natural as it is said that if we all agree, it means that we all are wrong.
_________________________
The Mohonk Mountain House and the Mohonk Preserve have done a great job protecting the environment thus far, but ... it's all down hill from here http://youtu.be/9AU8fMo8v4k.

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#67330 - 01/25/13 03:04 PM Re: Do you have what it takes to lie ...? [Re: oenophore]
retroscree Offline
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Don just likes to argue shit on the internet. Doesn't matter about what. It's a perverse hobby.

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#67331 - 01/25/13 04:29 PM Re: Do you have what it takes to lie ...? [Re: oenophore]
crimpy Offline
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Originally Posted By: oenophore
Gosh almighty -- what a &&*^&%^%$@#$ thread! crazy
I nominate Crimpy as its most sensible contributor.


whoever thought that would happen...thanks!

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#67333 - 01/25/13 06:42 PM Re: Do you have what it takes to lie ...? [Re: crimpy]
donald perry Offline
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Originally Posted By: retroscree
Don just likes to argue shit on the internet. Doesn't matter about what. It's a perverse hobby.


I object! On face value that sounds hypocritical, I would guess it is, unless I have misunderstood you. To prove it is not a hypocritical statement I think you would need to be hypocritical and argue to show it is not hypocritical. Are you being intentionally hypocritical?, I am trying to talk about ice climbing, what do you want to talk about? Please answer the question this time, I answer your questions.

You never answered my question that I posted before twice.

Early on you wrote: "Since you're now in totally hypothetical-land, I'd have tapped my communicator and had Scotty beam me up.". Then later you wrote: "No, most couldn't, frankly because you don't have the writing ability to adequately convey that." in response to "You can see from the first lines that the post is meant to be sarcastic,...".

You understood my first post to be hypothetical, you said: "most couldn't" , and defined my post as "hypothetical". Please stop complaining when there is nothing to complain about, when you do that you are posting off topic.

OK, since you are unable to answer these questions can we now try and get back on topic? The topic is, what would you have done on slushy ice? I presume that to answer this someone may need to go out there in person to prove what is the correct answer. Would you be willing to do this? I would be, but presently I think it is too cold.

But in the mean time, not to be rude, we are trying to find out if ice-climbing is what this thread is really about in the first place by answering RangerRob. So now we are talking about what is and what is not sarcasm. To answer this we are now down a rabbit trail presently trying to figure out if a previous post was conditional past tense or Counterfactual conditional. Maybe you agree that it is Counterfactual conditional, which is why you are now trying to confuse the process again of getting back on topic as usual. That would make sense!

So then I need to be straightforward and ask you directly. A straightforward solution to this question would help us get back on topic. Since you agree why don't you just say so, so we can climb up out of this pit, that the "grammar police" has thrown us into?
_________________________
The Mohonk Mountain House and the Mohonk Preserve have done a great job protecting the environment thus far, but ... it's all down hill from here http://youtu.be/9AU8fMo8v4k.

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#67334 - 01/25/13 07:07 PM Re: Do you have what it takes to lie ...? [Re: donald perry]
GOclimb Offline
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Registered: 03/26/01
Posts: 2362
Loc: Boston
Why do you guys all keep responding to Don's posts? I could tell from his first post that he'd seen this video online and was pretending to be the guy in the video.

I've no idea, maybe in person he makes perfect sense, but carrying on with Don here is like arguing with your cat - sure, you both have opinions, but the cat doesn't understand you, and you don't understand it, and there's no real lasting communication possible.

GO

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#67335 - 01/25/13 08:21 PM Re: Do you have what it takes to lie ...? [Re: GOclimb]
retroscree Offline
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Originally Posted By: GOclimb
I've no idea, maybe in person he makes perfect sense, but carrying on with Don here is like arguing with your cat - sure, you both have opinions, but the cat doesn't understand you, and you don't understand it, and there's no real lasting communication possible.

To me it seems more like arguing with a box of hammers.
I understand my cat better than anything the Donald posts.

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#67336 - 01/25/13 09:35 PM Re: Do you have what it takes to lie ...? [Re: retroscree]
donald perry Offline
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Registered: 06/27/11
Posts: 1536
Loc: New Jersey
Originally Posted By: retroscree
Originally Posted By: GOclimb
I've no idea, maybe in person he makes perfect sense, but carrying on with Don here is like arguing with your cat - sure, you both have opinions, but the cat doesn't understand you, and you don't understand it, and there's no real lasting communication possible.

To me it seems more like arguing with a box of hammers.
I understand my cat better than anything the Donald posts.



I don't believe your telling the truth.

Early on you wrote: "Since you're now in totally hypothetical-land, I'd have tapped my communicator and had Scotty beam me up.". Then later you wrote: "No, most couldn't, frankly because you don't have the writing ability to adequately convey that." in response to "You can see from the first lines that the post is meant to be sarcastic,...". You understood my first post to be hypothetical, you said: "most couldn't" , and defined my post as "hypothetical".
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The Mohonk Mountain House and the Mohonk Preserve have done a great job protecting the environment thus far, but ... it's all down hill from here http://youtu.be/9AU8fMo8v4k.

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#67337 - 01/25/13 09:48 PM Re: Do you have what it takes to lie ...? [Re: GOclimb]
donald perry Offline
veteran

Registered: 06/27/11
Posts: 1536
Loc: New Jersey
Originally Posted By: GOclimb
Why do you guys all keep responding to Don's posts? I could tell from his first post that he'd seen this video online and was pretending to be the guy in the video.

I've no idea, maybe in person he makes perfect sense, but carrying on with Don here is like arguing with your cat - sure, you both have opinions, but the cat doesn't understand you, and you don't understand it, and there's no real lasting communication possible.

GO


I don't believe you either. You write "I could tell from his first post that he'd seen this video online and was pretending to be the guy in the video." followed by "I've no idea, ... don't understand it". But we just happen to be answering that question right now with a series of questions.

The first question was, is "Where art thou Romeo" conditional past tense or counterfactual conditional tense. What do you think? I realize we are somewhat off track. But I am not wholly responsible for that. I am only trying to cooperate and answer pertinent questions.
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The Mohonk Mountain House and the Mohonk Preserve have done a great job protecting the environment thus far, but ... it's all down hill from here http://youtu.be/9AU8fMo8v4k.

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#67341 - 01/26/13 10:48 AM Re: Do you have what it takes to lie ...? [Re: donald perry]
mgree Offline
stranger

Registered: 03/08/12
Posts: 10
Loc: Philadelphia, PA
I will surely come to regret pointing this out, but it's "wherefore art thou, Romeo". Though it's archaic, "art" is a simple present tense conjugation of "to be".

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#67343 - 01/26/13 01:35 PM Re: Do you have what it takes to lie ...? [Re: donald perry]
donald perry Offline
veteran

Registered: 06/27/11
Posts: 1536
Loc: New Jersey
Originally Posted By: mgree
I will surely come to regret pointing this out, but it's "wherefore art thou, Romeo". Though it's archaic, "art" is a simple present tense conjugation of "to be".


Because Shakespeare's Juliet never said "Where are you", and said somehting completly differnet ("Why are you Romeo") what case is it? I think I am disqualified from answering because I was wrong once already.

Another question(s) (second, third) is which case is:

"Where are you"

"Why are you"
_________________________
The Mohonk Mountain House and the Mohonk Preserve have done a great job protecting the environment thus far, but ... it's all down hill from here http://youtu.be/9AU8fMo8v4k.

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#67344 - 01/26/13 04:30 PM Re: Do you have what it takes to lie ...? [Re: donald perry]
donald perry Offline
veteran

Registered: 06/27/11
Posts: 1536
Loc: New Jersey
Romeo and Juliet Full movie -English Subtitles- (1968) Part 1
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=A6nYKmD5WX4

Romeo and Juliet Full movie -English Subtitles- (1968) Part 2
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UM3eFN96VaM
_________________________
The Mohonk Mountain House and the Mohonk Preserve have done a great job protecting the environment thus far, but ... it's all down hill from here http://youtu.be/9AU8fMo8v4k.

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#67345 - 01/27/13 12:10 AM Re: Do you have what it takes to lie ...? [Re: donald perry]
crimpy Offline
enthusiast

Registered: 07/02/11
Posts: 331
Loc: Wawarsing

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#67346 - 01/27/13 02:53 AM Re: Do you have what it takes to lie ...? [Re: crimpy]
donald perry Offline
veteran

Registered: 06/27/11
Posts: 1536
Loc: New Jersey
Seriously, that is the *best movie* I ever saw (Except of course for Ricksters Namless Tower link of course). You should watch it crimpy. I will give you A dollar you can make it to the end of the movie without shedding a tear.


Edited by donald perry (01/27/13 03:20 AM)
_________________________
The Mohonk Mountain House and the Mohonk Preserve have done a great job protecting the environment thus far, but ... it's all down hill from here http://youtu.be/9AU8fMo8v4k.

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#67347 - 01/27/13 03:02 PM Re: Do you have what it takes to lie ...? [Re: donald perry]
crimpy Offline
enthusiast

Registered: 07/02/11
Posts: 331
Loc: Wawarsing
will do.sure i will cry....snoopy come home killed me recently!

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#67429 - 02/20/13 05:27 AM Re: Do you have what it takes to lie ...? [Re: crimpy]
worthrussell Offline
journeyman

Registered: 04/11/10
Posts: 90
Loc: NY, Brooklyn
Here is past presesnt and future. Donald perry was, is and always will post total crap. Why do I look? It's like watching a train wreck, you dont wanna see it but you cant tuen away

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