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#71523 - 06/09/14 05:42 PM Gunks bouldering for sending 5.10 through 5.11+
GOclimb Offline
Pooh-Bah

Registered: 03/26/01
Posts: 2361
Loc: Boston
Hi Folks,

After six years away from the east coast, I\'m coming back. I plan to spend a good bit of time at the Gunks. Would be cool to meet you all. But that\'s for another thread.

I always found the climbing quite unique, and didn\'t find that anything but climbing at the Gunks prepared me for climbing at the Gunks. So I expect it to take me a quite a while to get in tune with the rock again.

When I left, I was really only just breaking in to low to mid 5.10s (done perhaps a dozen). I plan to back up a bit until I get the feel of things. But once I do, I would like to start pushing the grades a bit on reasonably well protected climbs.

For those of you who climb (or have climbed) tens and elevens at the Gunks, did you boulder at the Gunks? Do you think it helped much? Or did you just climb routes?

I\'ve never been much of a boulderer, and, in fact, the one time I tried doing any established boulder problems at the Gunks, I got royally spanked. But I\'m willing to dedicate some time to training - in whatever form it takes. And I wonder if Gunks bouldering (in addition to getting Gunks mileage again) might be the best form of training I could do.

Thoughts?

Thanks!

GO

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#71524 - 06/10/14 02:43 AM Re: Gunks bouldering for sending 5.10 through 5.11+ [Re: GOclimb]
rg@ofmc Online   content
Pooh-Bah

Registered: 12/25/99
Posts: 2472
Loc: Poughkeepsie, NY
Welcome back!

I\'m not convinced that Gunks bouldering in general is all that specific to the climbs, but I\'d make an exception for the traverses, which have the advantage of allowing you to push the fatigue level without ending up looking at a longish fall. I think the best single boulder training traverse for Gunks climbing is Box Car boulder laps.

Since I retired from bouldering some years ago, I can\'t say whether there are new problems (perhaps some at Peterskill?) that would also suit.

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#71528 - 06/10/14 05:17 PM Re: Gunks bouldering for sending 5.10 through 5.11+ [Re: rg@ofmc]
GOclimb Offline
Pooh-Bah

Registered: 03/26/01
Posts: 2361
Loc: Boston
Thanks!

And RG, I appreciate your opinion, knowing that you did a lot of bouldering back in the day, and also put up (or did early ascents) on many of those tens and elevens I hope to try.

I\'ll look for Box Car boulder. How hard is it? Looks like around V4 based on what I\'m seeing on MP. That sounds pretty much right for where I\'d need to train. Is it this line in yellow?

http://www.mountainproject.com/v/106522681

Anyone else know of good long boulder problems that could be helpful?

Anyone disagree with RG? Is training on power problems of much use?

Thanks!

GO

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#71531 - 06/10/14 07:04 PM Re: Gunks bouldering for sending 5.10 through 5.11+ [Re: GOclimb]
fotovult Online   content
member

Registered: 09/01/05
Posts: 141
Loc: ny
Agreed on the endurance, but I found most gains to come with increase in roped mileage. My experience with bouldering is it is too close to the edge of injury - often I\'d push the training on boulders and end up hurt. Plus the gain in strength doesn\'t work the mental game, and headier 10s like Welcome or Graveyard may not be super hard but require a good head to lead through.

A good route to leading gunks 10s and 11s confidently is to get out there and push yourself on 9s, developing strength and finding the good head you had before. Routes like Jean, Commando Rave, Beetle Brow, Le Teton, even Modern Times, that are either hard well-protected moves or endurance climbing at the grade should be good starting points.

Climbing the routes on TR can help with endurance, but I always default to leading more (and harder) to up your lead game, for whatever that\'s worth.
_________________________
www.chrisvultaggio.com

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#71532 - 06/10/14 08:25 PM Re: Gunks bouldering for sending 5.10 through 5.11+ [Re: fotovult]
GOclimb Offline
Pooh-Bah

Registered: 03/26/01
Posts: 2361
Loc: Boston
I totally agree on mileage. That is absolutely my first priority. I was just wondering if there was any \"supplemental\" training that might be valuable. And the first and most obvious thing I thought of was bouldering. I figure the moves on the little Gunks rocks might be more like the moves on the big Gunks rocks than anything I\'d find in a gym or hangboard or whatever.

I agree, too, on injuries. Most of my injuries to pulleys and such have come from bouldering.

GO

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#71533 - 06/10/14 09:42 PM Re: Gunks bouldering for sending 5.10 through 5.11+ [Re: GOclimb]
rg@ofmc Online   content
Pooh-Bah

Registered: 12/25/99
Posts: 2472
Loc: Poughkeepsie, NY
Of course bouldering won\'t necessarily help the mental aspect of leading, although having more endurance can certainly calm you down. Mileage is important too, but bouldering is something you can do by yourself at odd or inconvenient times for climbing.

The Box Car boulder is ideal for a number of reasons. One is that the traverse is really near the ground; you aren\'t likely to get hurt jumping off and you really don\'t need a spotter. Another is that it isn\'t terribly tweaking. There are perhaps four fingery moves with minimal feet at the right side, but I don\'t think the holds are small enough to do bad things to the tendons of a 5.10 climber.

The route is indeed the yellow line in the MP link. The fingery hard part is from 10 to 8, and there is a pretty good rest at 8 before you head out on the easier but pumpy remainder of the route. I\'d recommend at first starting at the right end to get it over with, and then hang on for the rest of it. Once you start doing laps there are various strategies...

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#71534 - 06/10/14 10:48 PM Re: Gunks bouldering for sending 5.10 through 5.11+ [Re: GOclimb]
kenr Offline
newbie

Registered: 10/05/10
Posts: 36
Originally Posted By: GOclimb
I always found Gunks climbing quite unique, and didn\'t find that anything but climbing at the Gunks prepared me for it.

I\'ve also been wanting to start bouldering to prepare to climb more 10s + 11s in the Gunks. Because there\'s not much good Sport climbing near southern NY, so bouldering seems like the most time-effective way to practice lots of hard moves on outdoor rock.

My concern about Gunks bouldering is that the few problems (with good landings) I\'ve looked at so far do not seem much like the cruxes of the Gunks 5.10s I\'ve done so far. My theory is this is because the Gunks cliffs are mainly about (a) steep slab climbing, and (b) overhangs/roofs with horizontals. But the big chunks of rocks that long ago separated from the cliffs and rolled down to be counted as \"boulders\" are mostly not at the appropriate angle to be specifically relevant practice for the Gunks on-cliff cruxes (i.e. the linear features are no longer horizontal, and the featureless \"slabby\" surfaces are not at the correct incline).

Also some of the popular problems near the Uberfall have (interesting fun) features from explosive blasting.

Just my limited ignorance in need of correction.

So while I see how the Boxcar traverse is a generally good training thing, I\'m not seeing its specific relevance to Gunks 5.10-11 cruxes on the cliffs above.

Anyway just what is it about Gunks 10s and 11s which is unique?

Thanks for helpful corrections and suggestions.

Ken


Edited by kenr (06/10/14 10:52 PM)

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#71535 - 06/11/14 11:38 AM Re: Gunks bouldering for sending 5.10 through 5.11+ [Re: kenr]
rg@ofmc Online   content
Pooh-Bah

Registered: 12/25/99
Posts: 2472
Loc: Poughkeepsie, NY
I\'d suggest working the Boxcar traverse until, say, you can go across and back. (BITD, folks like Kevin Bein and Steve Wunsch could do at least double that.) Then report back whether helped your ability to do 10\'s and 11\'s (and 12\'s for that matter). If you are sceptical now, I think you\'ll be surprised...

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#71536 - 06/11/14 03:47 PM Re: Gunks bouldering for sending 5.10 through 5.11+ [Re: kenr]
fotovult Online   content
member

Registered: 09/01/05
Posts: 141
Loc: ny
Originally Posted By: kenr


My concern about Gunks bouldering is that the few problems (with good landings) I\\\'ve looked at so far do not seem much like the cruxes of the Gunks 5.10s I\\\'ve done so far.


I agree - especially when that crux involves hanging on to work in a brassie, 15-ft above your last piece, while your leg is working like a singer sewing machine and you will your slipping fingers to stay put on delicate holds.

Strength and endurance go a long way, but I know more than a few climbers who can comfortably climb 5.12 but won\'t lead half the 10s in the gunks because they don\'t have the mental game.
_________________________
www.chrisvultaggio.com

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#71537 - 06/11/14 04:00 PM Re: Gunks bouldering for sending 5.10 through 5.11+ [Re: rg@ofmc]
kenr Offline
newbie

Registered: 10/05/10
Posts: 36
Thanks -- I\'ll be glad to take your recommendation that the Boxcar is specific helpful preparation for harder routes on the Gunks cliffs above.

Ken

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