Ivan and the Saum

It's a bit dirty and there's lots of loose rock.

Is this post a...
a) question?
b) statement?
c) general observation?

As with many of the "hidden gem" routes being reccomended recently, that's no surprise to me...plus you can tell that just by standing at the base of double crack and looking at the thing. I might add that just 'cause something's dirty doesn't mean its not worthwhile...but hey, I still have enough multi-starred climbs I haven't gotten around to yet.

Plus, it's one of Ivan's routes and I've always found those...umm...interesting

Read the Bragg interview, the part about adventure. These are not sport climbs prepared for the convenience of the masses. It IS a good climb.

Lichen won't hurt you. Did you know that the entire Trapps was covered with lichen when Hans and Fritz first visited? That's why the first route they did was at Millbrook (Old Route). The Trapps were unclimbable, so they thought. Eventually the cliffs cleaned up, part due to the passage of climbers, and part, I think, due to environmental changes (acid rain?).

Ivan, remember what you said about Gunks standards slipping? Well, I think you hit the nail on the head.

God, I wish I was born twenty years earlier...

I didn't say it was a bad climb; I actually enjoyed it. But it is dirty and loose and for me, those features were part of its appeal.

Hi Jinx is good too. maybe a little less loose rock. It is exciting and steep, and my partner had to finish it for me... the holds right at and above the crux move were encrusted in dirt... above the crux section it just gets too dirty though. I have not tried Ivan and the Saum yet.
Dirt and Lichen can be fun!

How about Zig Zag Face just to the right? I remember a lot of lichen. And not much gear. Should we start a "Crusty Classics" thread? There must be a bunch in the middle of the nears (some are mine for sure). First pitch of Reach of Faith was pretty bad (mine again). Crustacean Syndrome? There must be some crusty climbs that are NOT mine...

Even though it has a star (and is a damn good route, by the way) Day Tripper Direct was surprisingly dirty--one of the key holds was completely encrusted in dirt and moss...but it should be a lot better now.

Speaking of which...has anyone ever thought of linking up the Boston Tree Party open book with the finish to Day Tripper Direct? You'd have to go left at the BTP roof instead of the usual right, but it looks like it'd be really cool...avoiding the grunge on the DTD chimney thing.

Interesting replies to my original post. I simply said what is true about the route and people read all sorts of things into the statement.

Reach of Faith was pretty good, I thought.

The DTD chimney part can be pretty much entirely avoided just by jamming, stemming, and face climbing around it. But I've done it both ways, and I thought the chimney moves were a lot of fun too.

Quote:

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Interesting replies to my original post. I simply said what is true about the route and people read all sorts of things into the statement.

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Not to be brash, but that probably happened because the post was overly short and gave no indication of its direction...as I said in my original post, it left me with the impression "I&S is dirty and...what next?"

Just my two cents, but more specificity in posting will prompt more specific replies...